ray ruthven

Interested to hear how you get on with the P7's, we put a set on our 'runabout' E36 325 because the price was right. Much better overall than the Direzza's we had previously, smoother ride, quieter, more balanced feel but lacking a touch of turn in. The surprising part is my son has done 2 track days in the car at Puke and they performed amazingly well, obviouly the ultimate grip was not there, but the car was a joy to drive at the limit and has minimal tyre wear. Overall a surprising result from what was a bargain buy.

Hi 3 Pedals, interesting, I wouldn't have expected that much of a difference. I've been looking at wheel tyre combinations on our race car and contact patch is of course one of the considerations, but we haven't been looking at the types of differences we're talking about here. However I had a little geometry program to look at it so threw in my car (1800kg on 245/45/17's) and assumed your's is a 255/50/19. I have 282 sq cm contact patch and didn't take much to get the 380 or so you have. Did result in a little larger sidewall deflection but not a lot - 19% compared to 15%. of course a few assumptions in this but an interesting exercise. (see diagram) RDR1 Contact_patches_17_and_19.ppt

Well it looks as if this thread has reached a conclusion I had suspected - the top end tyres ARE better if you want to pay the price. The wear issue is then a significant one in comparing the top 3 - particularly as I am putting down 750Nm at the rear wheels and can only get 245's in. That is one reason I think the Sumitomo's performed well - for a 245 the actual TREAD width is significantly more than most of the other brands. Speaking of the rubber on the road, how do you get a 70% increase in contact patch on the X5 for only a 13% increase in section width? or does the 255 actually have a soft side wall giving you the larger contact patch? RDR1

Thanks for more confusing input! My previous conclusions from comments would have been that the Michelin PSS would be much better on wear, which would agree with their treadwear ratings. Seems as if there are confilicting points of view for most issues to do with tyres! although the ones at the top of the pile seem to be constant, it makes making a final choice less easy. RDR1

Damn, you've thrown in another option 3 Pedals, I was leaning very strongly to the Michelin Pilot Super Sport, with the Sport Contact 3 and goodyear F1 asymmetric close seconds. I'd pretty much discounted the Pirelli's - no great comments and neither of the ones you mention do well in the tirerack tests or reviews - however I always used to run Pirelli's and have P7's on the E36 325 - nicely balanced and much better noise/comfort than the Direzzas, but not as responsive (which wasn't what we wre looking for). Have you tried the Michelin PSS? I've not seen anything bad about them other than the cost? Also which Bridgestones specifically/ RE11? Third on my list. Unfortunately it still looks as if taking money out of the equation the choice is still not clear cut - although I suspect any of the ones mentioned will be rewarding tyres. RDR1

I had the car in for a warrant this weekend so took the opportunity to put back on an older set of tyres, just to make sure my memory was not kidding me. Sport Contacts on the front and the Sumitomo's on the rear, and the car is MUCH better. Better feel, turn-in, balance and general driveability - the only down side is an increase in harshness at the front. I regret now going for a value/average option? the Sport Maxx. It definately reduced my driving pleasure for the last 12 months. Obviously I still have to pick 'the best tyre' ! but I now have plenty of advice to weigh up. RDR1

Plenty of interesting comments again! and some more thoughts back in the "you gets what you pays for" camp. With my weekend driver I'm looking at at least 3 to 4 years of driving on a set so maybe the investment starts to make sense, especially going the Goodyear route which seems reasonably priced given the rave reviews I see everywhere. The one issue I am seeing is that the 245/45 seems to be asking for a $100 a tyre premium over the 245/40 - I have a hard time seeing the sense in that. Apex, I sympathise with you on the issues with running a new control tyre, my son and I do Formula First racing and we changed control tyres for last season (average 70 profile street tyres) it took a while to realise that the operating window was different and the temperature drop off was very sharp. Made a mess of our pre-season handling experiment testing!! RDR

I hear what you are saying and that's what I am trying to understand, what is the benefit. On the other hand if you have spent money modifying the car, shocks, roll bars, springs etc I am frustrated not to be able to get the full benefit for the sake of the tyres. It's like adding cams, manifolds etc and putting in a rev limiter! I must admit I'm not convinced what to do yet and the RE002's do seem to be racking up the votes. Shame you can't get a free test! RDR1

Sorry for the last post - hit the wrong button. Thanks for the replies so far, although I must admit a little surprised. I was expecting to hear the praise of Continentals, Michelins and Pirelli's with maybe a goodyear F1 thrown in - instead there is a lot of talk of 'best value' etc. Is that because there really is little difference with these high price options (all supposedly avaialable at Hyper)? or am I missing something? I must admit I was not considering wear as a factor as only a weekend car but 10,000km's is a surprise. The tyres I have used are; Dunlop Sport Maxx current tire- quite good at times but very tempermental, need to keep a good track on the pressures and responds horribly to load changes on the front (accel & braking) Falken 912 - just horrible, unpredictable and very loose. Sport Contact (2 I think), nice feel but very coarse and noisy But significantly the best, Sumitomo HTRZII, (I put on the car before bringing it in from the states) good blend of everything, great feel but so so in the wet. Only real problem was they wore quite unevenly. Any more comments would be welcome, but with Hybrids comments and tire rack looks as if the Michelin PSS would get a top vote? RDR1

I read the Wheels and Tyre section frequently and enjoy the debates, knowledge and amount of tyres people have used! so the question should be simple - if price was not an issue what tyre would you pick for a road car - not knowing it's behaviour to different tyre types? More specifically I have an older non-BMW (although I have owned 5 BMW's including a track car and currently a 325) that has been significantly upgraded and now runs 245/45 - 17's. It is about the size weight and performance of a 5 series. If I ranked goals it would be road feel and steering response 1st, closely followed by road harshness/ride, noise, dry grip and wet grip last. I have tried a few tyres in the last few years with quite different, but dissappointing results - however price has always been a factor. So if I want to get the best out of the car what is 'The best tyre"? Look forward to reading some comments. RDR

I have just joined the forum with my son "David Ruthven" with our '94 325SE. I am wondering if anyone has experienced noise problems with the Dunlop Direzza tyres. We have 215/45-17's on 5 spoke BMW wheels and have an annoying fluctuating whine. It sort of sounds like a gear mesh type of whine but does not change at all with load on the drive, on or off throttle or clutch in, it is speed related and appears to move from the front to back of the car under some conditions. Road surface sometimes has an effect on the noise but it never goes away above 40 kph. It does seem to peak at aabout 40 and 80 kph? I've tried different pressures and again only a small effect. We have only just bought the car, 3 weeks ago, and do not remember it being there on 3 test drives - although we were liking the exhaust note at that time!! Any suggestions? Ray,