Ownership Costs - E36 vs E30

[E30stz 0]

Ok -

It looks like in the next week I'm going to have my Beamer finally.

My parents arent 100% behind the idea of me getting a E30 and think I should get an E36 based around the idea that they will cost less to maintain.

I realise not all of you will have experienced or own each of these models, but if you could give me an idea of what I should expect or may some advice on what to go with. At the moment its looking like an early 90's E36 or a Late 80's E30.

The E30 I'm off to have a look at tomorrow is on 100,000 km's - has service history and has been regularly serviced. Cambelt hasnt been done by owner (who has owned it for the last year).

I will make sure to check the log to see what work has been done in the recent years etc.

NB: this is not based on which one you prefer - based around which one is more economical to own

Edited January 30, 2005 by E30stz

[kiwi535 538]

well thats tough.Obviously every thing being as it should a 20 year old car will cost more to run than a 10 year old car,but it will depend entirely on how they have been looked after.If you get an e30 which has been well looked after it could well be that it requires no immediate work whereas a 10 yr old e36 will require its first lot of maintenance.I am not particularly familiar with what goes wrong with e30's or E36's but the E30 will prolly be easier to work on than the e36 in that the e36 will have more computers and more "systems",which if they do go wrong =$$$$,unless you can get them from a wrecker.....and what are you looking at 316's or 325(8's ) to many variables.

Also that realise any car that is over 5 years old WILL require some maintenance,be it radiator,thermostat,water pump,maybe suspension bushings(not unheard in BMW's by the way),and get ready for consumables like brake pads rotors,tyres,filters.......

[E30stz 0]

Sorry I should clarify this a bit more - with the money I have to spend id be looking at a

E30 - 1988 - 1991 (14-17 years old)

or an

E36 - 1991 - 1993 (12- 14 years old)

Edited January 30, 2005 by E30stz

[bimmer boy 21]

i think i would go for a E36 based on the age point of veiw of things

[Guest Spargo]

I feel i'm well justified to comment here, learnt to drive in an E30, now in an E36.

Simply put, E36's will need less maintenance on the whole, but the early E36's are piles of sh*t well worth avoiding, 95 is about the earliest year you'd want to buy.

Given the choices above, the late spec E30 is the way to go, as they're put together so much better its not funny.

[E30_318i 0]

What kind of E36?

Wasn't there a bit of teething problems with the 91/92 VANOS 6 cyl engines in the E36/E34?

Personally I would get a NZ new E30 325 manual, which will probably be more economical, quicker, and cheaper to fix and service over an E36 6cyl, not to mention the purchase price of both models. E36 318s are probably slower than E30 318's, and seem to be the cheapest E36s.

Mint E30 for 5 grand at the most, or a dodgy E36 for 8k at the least?

[bimmer boy 21]

yea i think id avoid a E36 that is being sold too cheap because they are still worth quite a bit

but i dont know how much you are spending but yea proberbly a really good well maintained E30 would be better than a E36 that hasnt been treated to good... but i dont know any details about it so i cant really be the judge on that

but a well loved E30 with what i see has low K's for its age with service papers and everything sounds great

[E30_318i 0]

but a well loved E30 with what i see has low K's for its age with service papers and everything sounds great

Yea. It sounds even better when the E30 is cheaper than the cheapest E36s, going from what I've seen on trademe.co.nz and the Autotrader mag.

E30s aren't as common as E36s too. I reckon that mint versions will hold their value better, and will be much more sought after in years to come, a bit like 2002s are now (quite a long wait until that happens I think).

[BMW POWER 2]

Ok.

Based on what i have been told E36 320i is more economical than E30 320i.

I'm not sure about problems, but the E30 we had had next to none. The E36 had a couple though.

We had a 1991 E30 320i

now a 1994 E36 320i

Hope that helps

Emma

[bimmer boy 21]

but condsidering it is a 95 320 he is going to look at it may be sweet? with just a owner who under valued it? cos that kinda thing happens a lot

cos that happend to my mum in the mid 80's when my dad bought her a new cooper S for half the price it should have been .. hmm got a bit off topic there

but yea go have a look get them AA tested if you think its nessersary and if the e36 is sweet i say go for it and same goes for the E30 so then it will just come down to which kind you like the most

[BMW POWER 2]

I do agree with E30_318i

He has got a good point.

If you have a good 15 grand to spend, buy an E36.

If you have under 10, sort of 5-8 grand, get a good E30.

When i was reading the owners manual of the E36 last night, manual is less economical than auto. Maybe its the same with E30? Uh, i dunno.

Best bet would be to go with your gut feeling.

And

If in doubt don't..............................

If a cheap E30 needs work it might be trouble, get a mint E30 with no work for that little bit more.

Hope this helps, and good luck with your purchase of ya (first?) BMW.

Emma

[Guest Andrew]

I'm .. can't.. resist..

get a honda!

[OLLIE 26]

I'm .. can't.. resist..

get a honda!

w3rd

the man wants economy... the truth is spoken get a honda or toyota

but on the topic a well looked after e30 (not 318i cos they're slugs) imo is a better option than an early e36 for the money you pay anyway.

[318is 0]

Don't shag round with a E30 - go for the E36. 1995 onwards, considering the dosh you have to spend.

Pre '95, I believe, had the horrid profile gasket problems, and only a drivers air bag.

I am really happy with my bimmer, and im a fussy bastard to say the least.

PS: Go for a iS model if you can.

[Grant 4]

Right, heres my answer.

Maybe forget a choice between an E30 or E36 (unless you have a strong preference). Just concentrate on finding a good car, regardless of if it is an E30 or E36.

Why don't you try looking from what is around in both model shapes with the money you can afford, then start looking at other things like regular service history, what work has been done on it recently, what a mechanic (make sure you get someone who knows what they are talking about to have a thorough look over the car) thinks it may need etc.

If you can find a car (whether it is an E30 or an E36) that seems to be sound, has been well maintained in the past, will not need too much work in the future then go for that.

Both E30's and E36's that have not been looked after will inevitably need a lot of money spent over them over time to get them back in ship-shape condition. whereas both E30's and E36's that have been well maintained should both be pretty reliable, you just have to bear in mind that you are buying an older car that will no doubt have a few k's under its belt so it will from time to time need work carried out on it, just be prepared for that.

Good luck, and remember you will get what you pay for.

Cheers

[petone 0]

From what I've read about the early E36's I'd be a bit worried about owning one. However i'd also be a bit worried about an E30 with only a 100K on the clock. its probably coming up for a lot of maintenance work, ie cambelt, shocks, etc. Its not that bad buying a higher milage vehicle becuase chances are, everything thats going to go wrong has gone wrong.

My experiences with E30's...

My 87' 318i has been great. Its never left me stranded and i've only had one problem and that was the clutch MC, a $30 fix BTW. Uses no oil, no water, blows no smoke. And thats in a car thats 240K, it is NZ new though.

My mates 87' 320i was a shitter. Everything went wrong with it. Leaks everywhere, electrics clapped out, clutch clapped out, brakes barely worked. Engine clapped out. This car had done about 200K and was a UK import.

Also, i agree with whoever said e30's are easier to work on. So much less electronics. Will you do work yourself or get a shop to do it? I quite like working on cars, bikes etc so i dont mind doing preventive maintenance and fixing little problems.

318i's get a bit of sh*t for being slow (which i wont disagree with) but 320's arent much better. theres quite abit more weight for only an extra 15 hp. 5spd 318s are quicker than auto 320, and a manual 320i vs manual 318i would come down to the drivers.

My 2 cents.

[Surge 1]

I'll second what petone said regarding the performance between the 318i and the 320i, the jump between 318i and 325i is the real performance jump.

Don't be too hard on the 318i's, they aren't _that_ slow.

[bimmer boy 21]

yea exactly just cos a car is slower than other models doesnt mean you wont enjoy it at all

i want a 318 pretty much ideal for me

[Homy.D.Clown 0]

Its a first car guys...it doesnt need to be Fast..just reliable

316/318/320..its all good, and will do you fine as a entry level car.

if theyre both good condition cars ,i'd have to say go for the E30 as the early model E36's had some teething problems....as do most first model runs of cars.

not saying the E30's are perfect..

Its a hard call to make for us in internet land without seeing the cars , and knowing nothing about their history etc

....flip a coin and let fate decide..oooooo

[Hartage 0]

O K, my 2 cents.

Have Owned e30,( 4 ) e36 ( 1 ) e46 ( 1 ).

e30 on the whole Very reliable, reasonable cost for most parts, easy to service. Most parts are available and if not in NZ, can be got within 14 days. Service parts that are used on a regular time frame (oil , air filters ) are not expensive and I use only the Genuine parts. Have had 318i m done 70k when purchased, now has more than 175k onit and is in the family still. Been driven hard and basicly never let us down.

323i ( 3 ) first one 1983. Frist as road car, then race cars, apart from the saftey mods, are stock cars. Have still got one and has competed in the last two Dunlop Targas, and been mechanically total reliable.

e36 1996 318ti Is the least favorite of the 3 series that i have owned, But still was economical to service. Bought at 25k sold at 85k. total costs to own , other than oil and tyres, about $500.

If you are going to service the car yourself go with the best e30 you can find. The e36 is a more complex car, and i agree that the early ones were prone to annoying small faults that kept on happening.

My 2 cents as i see it from someone that does nearly all his own work.

[E30stz 0]

Just been to see one of the E30's.

Secksy in Black with nil scratches (could do with a meguiars to make it perfect). Service history from Team McMillan. The guy drives it weekends only as he is a courier driver and uses that during the week. Regularly service - had cambelt done a year or so back (the cars done 101,000 km's). Drove pretty nice - az zippy as my mums 318i. 4 owners in its lifetime.

Looks like its been well taken car of.

Minor problems

1) Has the whorey japanese numberplate holder on the back which hopefully hasnt left rust marks underneath.

2) Minor cosmetic problem with slight cracks in dash

3) BMW hubbys arent the shizzle. I'm sure some generous person would be able to sell me a set of bottlecaps for some $$$ and a box of alcomaholic beverages !

I thought 2 door would have been a problem but theres actually a fair deal of legroom back there.

I've decided since this is the first E30 I've driven so far to leave that car and test drive a few other cars to use as a benchmark up again this one. I was pretty impressed. My dad drove it a little and he was rather impressed, although he hasnt driven an E30 since the good ol times of the 323 he had in the late 80's.

[E30stz 0]

Oh yea another one that you guys might be able to clarify. We went down quite a rocky road and the suspension felt rather hard, is E30 suspension usually quite stiff ?

Cheers

Andrew

p.s thanks for all your help guys - much appreciated - hopefully we can introduce a new-born baby into the bimmersport family within the next week or two.

p.p.s Hartage - dad wants to know how much u want for the Targa car lol ! was thinking of entering his one if he hadnt sold it.

Edited January 31, 2005 by E30stz

[shadowninja 0]

All posts to date have focused almost entirely on maintenance costs.

From a financial perspective, the total cost of a car should include:

1. Cost of money (ie- interest on borrowings, time/value money)

2. Depreciation (gradual loss of value over time)

3. Maintenance & Upkeep costs

4. Fixed running costs (eg- insurance, registration)

5. Variable running costs (eg- fuel, oil etc).

For later model vehicles the depreciation factors in much more of an issue. When you sell the car further down the track the E36 should old more value than the E30 as later body shapes are generally more attractive.

Maintenance & upkeep, just like all others on the board so far, old cars need care. Generally the older the car the higher portion of its value you need to spend each year in keeping it in good form. Unless there are fundamental shortfalls with the E36 again I would generally expect there to be lower upkeep costs.

Having owned neither E30 nor E36 I can't comment on fuel efficiency.

Either way, good luck with your new baby & be sure to get pics.

[bmwsparkle 3]

sounds like a good e30 man. i personally like E30s more than E36s, and that sounds like a good 'un. Shud get some of these E30 nuts on here to come have a look with you. 318i? 5spd?

[E30stz 0]

Not a manual no - I wont flick out hte cliche about (oh im gonna change it too a manual ... promise) because i cant afford that sorta luxury yet and I'm trying 2 keep money spare for repairs although I could call that a repair hehe.

But I've looked at a few manuals ... and this one tops the lot even if it is an auto. I'd like to change it too a manual in the future but at the moment I just dont have the time / money to work with.

If there wasnt a timeframe I'd keep looking and find a manual, but at this stage I just wanna get a nice car. And this one looks like the shizzle so far.

Edited January 31, 2005 by E30stz