E38 Sub woofer install and amp upgrade

[jimbo01 0]

My objective is to improve the base in my E38. The constraints are I don't want an enclousre in the boot and i want to retain full use of the ski hatch. I have decided to base my install arround the rear sub enclosure from the DSP sound system.

I'm installing 2 new pioneer amps either side of the ski hatch, on the back panel in the boot. The 1st amp will connect into the speaker wiring (it has speaker level inputs). This amp will drive new Pioneer TS-C131PRS door speakers and is rated at 4x 75watts RMS. I'll use the filter to only send frequencies over 80Hz to the exisitng speakers pre-out from this amp will feed the 2nd amp.

The AMP is the Pioneer PRSD-4200F 4 CHANNEL bought from Hyper Drive and is currenly being specialed at less than 1/2 price. Photo attached

The 2nd amp will drive the two 6.5 inch Kicker subs. I'll run the amp in bridged mode; 2x 150 watts RMS and only feed frequencies below 100hz. I'll be using the standard DSP sub enclosure but will be blanking off 2 of the 4 speaker holes.

The Kicker subs are the COMPVT65 rated at 300Watts peak, 150 watts RMS, and down to 25hz. The mounting depth is only 7.1cm.

Edited October 3, 2010 by jimbo

[Apex 693]

If you want Kicker I have an account and could get them for you at a bloody sharp price, Just have a look at the kicker website and let know what you want, I can have it sent to you direct.

Can recommend their wiring kits too, they are top notch but a bit expensive.

Edited August 9, 2010 by Apex

[jimbo01 0]

If you want Kicker I have an account and could get them for you at a bloody sharp price, Just have a look at the kicker website and let know what you want, I can have it sent to you direct.

Can recommend their wiring kits too, they are top notch but a bit expensive.

Sweet - I'[ll PM you

[nigel_1981 0]

Sweet - I'[ll PM you

Any chance of getting me a price? I'm after either an L5 or L7 10" square sub to go in the ski pass hole (not yet cut).

[jimbo01 0]

I'm making progress. My mission is installing subwoofers using the OEM factory sub housing. I made a paper template of the profile of the speaker I wanted to use and there was no way I could get it to fit. The flat suface on the sub enclosure was made for a speaker only 140mmin diameter, and only has a 127mm cutout (1st pic). The Kicker speaker I'm using needs a 140mm cutout, and a flat surface of about 158mm

I thought I was at an impass as I had been thinking of making spacers using custom wood. However I went hunting and today found a set of plastic 25mm spacers at SuperCheapAutos. (pic 2) I got them home and modified the heck out of the outer plastic ring with a hacksaw and file to make them fit over the two outer speaker cutouts, and the moulded parts of the subwoofer enclosure (pic 3)

They are now both fitting perfectly (pic 4) Next step will be application of lots of epoxy and screwing them to the enclosure. I'll make sure they are well sealed with a few costs of epoxy. Anyway by the weekend I should be ready to actually install the speakers and install the enclosure in the car.

I'm installing 2 Kicker 08CVT654 6.5 inch subs, and blanking out the two inner cutouts. I am aniticpating not being able to use the factory speaker grills but then again I'll think of something.

[jimbo01 0]

If you want Kicker I have an account and could get them for you at a bloody sharp price, Just have a look at the kicker website and let know what you want, I can have it sent to you direct.

Can recommend their wiring kits too, they are top notch but a bit expensive.

Thankyou - the subs were on my office chair this morning. I liked the bloody sharp price and the willingness to help out another Bimmersport member.

I've used the metal plates that come with the speakers to close off the spare inner cutouts in the enclosure.

The Kicker 08CVT65 is an impressive little speaker; build quality is good, and it's a really solid and heavier than expected.

Edited October 3, 2010 by jimbo

[Apex 693]

No worries mate, glad to hear you got them ok.

Just noticed your front components are the same as what I run, test mount those tweeters as they are firkin powerful, mine were so bright I turned them away from direct air shot. Probably obvious but better to test and get it right first time.

System is going to sound the biz, you should get a fantastic sound stage and a seamless blend of bass, mid a treble, are you controlling output with the factory deck?

Edited August 26, 2010 by resident know it all

[jimbo01 0]

No worries mate, glad to hear you got them ok.

Just noticed your front components are the same as what I run, test mount those tweeters as they are firkin powerful, mine were so bright I turned them away from direct air shot. Probably obvious but better to test and get it right first time.

System is going to sound the biz, you should get a fantastic sound stage and a seamless blend of bass, mid a treble, are you controlling output with the factory deck?

Cutting into the speaker wires from the OEM stereo and feeding into the pioneer amp, which has a fair degree of control over sound using hi and low pass filters, gain control, and a 12db subsonic filter at 20hz. I'll take a preout feed from the 1st amp to a 2nd amp which i'll run in bridged mode to power the two kicker subs.

Fitting the pionner crossovers in the doors may be a tight fit, but I'm still thinking of getting a pro to do the door speakers. I'm nervous about stuffing up the door trim.

[Apex 693]

Its going to be a tight fit, the speakers have a massive chassis, double the size of the stock ones.

Those speakers will be bugger all better than factory if they are not installed with a nice flat flush tight seal, so it may be a good idea to have them mounted buy a pro, they may need a decent amount of spacing just to clear the window mech.

Keep us all updated.

[jimbo01 0]

Decided 2 spacers on the subs was a totally crap look, and meant the blind wouldn't be able to clear the speaker either.

So yesterday I cut the base of the OEM sub enclosure to make space for the kicker speaker magnets. I will close the holes with fibreglass mat, and epoxy resin. (Tip - when cutting a platic enclosure resting on you legs, be careful when the saw goes through the plastic. I have a nice hole in my knee from the saw). 1st pick shows the spacer in place, and the hile cust on the enclosure. The trim is over the top and 'almost' fits.

Today I used screws and epoxy glue / filler to join the spacers to the sub woofer enclosure. It says it take up to 7 days top cure to full hardness so I guess thats next weekend for the fibre glass work. The 2nd pick shows this - used plenty of epoxy for a good seal. And yes it does look disgusting

[jimbo01 0]

I got the trim cut to fit arround the speaker spacers this weekend - and now I need to find a suitable glue to re-glue the cloth. Any recommendations?

Used a plastic ice cream container for material to close off the holes I cut in the subwoofer enclosure. Lots of epoxy glue used and currently drying. Used this to form a basic shape that I can add layers of fibre glass mat and more epoxy to. Will look at installing next Saturday.

[jimbo01 0]

Bought the Ados F2 glue spray today so I'll get the trim all sorted before the weekend.

Used epoxy and screws to close off the 2 spare speaker holes with the Kicker metal plates. Aiming to mount in the car this Saturday!

Edited September 18, 2010 by jimbo

[jimbo01 0]

Sub Woofer Install.

Physically complete apart from some customise trim to tidy up around the subs

Installed the rear sub enclosure, re-fitted the rear seats. , and installed the 2 Pioneer amps.

Amplifier Install

Physically complete and all of the electrical connections to the amps have been done at the amp. I havn't connected into the car wiring yet as my back is sore from getting in and out of the boots to drill the mounting holes for the amps,and screw the amps into place.

The sub amp just needs to have it's wiring connected to the power and earth.

The door speaker amp needs it's wiring to be connected into the cars speaker wiring, and it's power, earth and an accessory connectied. Another hour or so, some soldering, and some heat shrink should see it finished.

Reversing Camera

Haven't found a violet/white wire near the right tail light yet which I need to power the reversing camera. Also the blue plug connection pin 14 which I'm supposed to use to conbects the camera video shield isn't spare so thats holding me up .

Navigation Retro Fit

This is waiting until I finish connecting the amp into the speaker wiring. The antenna is in place.

Blind Retro-fit

This is physically fitted BUT I can't use the blind as it will catch on the subspeaker spacer. I may get another enclosure, and black trim at some point and modify it so I can fit the sub so it will fit within the standard speaker trim. IF I do this i can get the rear blind working. Right now this isn't top of my priorty list.

Edited September 19, 2010 by jimbo

[jimbo01 0]

After returning from our rained out ski holiday I put some time into sorting out the BMW wiring I need to tap into. Despite being somewhat under the weather from a nasty cough and fever I was able to learn all I needed to know from that WDS BMW wiring site.

Turns out I have the HiFi stereo with 10 speakers and 10 individual outputs for the speakers from the amplifier. The Left Right Front and Rear outputs from the raido can be picked up from the 12 pin plug for input to the new amps. It also has a ACC equivalent wire which is white (not the white / violet I'd been looking for and still havn't located).

I will remove the standard HiFi amplifier and remove the standard BMW plugs to the amp. I can mount the rather large cross-overs for my door speakers under the rear tray, or where the HiFi amp was located, and use the individual wiring to the tweeters and woofers.

I won't be doing any wiring until I'm a lot better though.

[diablo23 1]

great project very good read

[gouba 0]

I like tidy wiring awesome job

[jimbo01 0]

Finally got it all wired in today and am very happy to be able to say every thing is working perfectly.

Rear subs: The improvement to base is very noticable, but without sounding out of balance - exactly what I was hoping for. 'We come one' by Faithless is awesome!

The Pioneer reference series amps have made a noticiable improvement to the sound - and thats with the original door speakers still in place. Will get professionals to mount the door speakers.

The reversing camera is also working great.

The MKIII naigation system is also fully functional and we will use it tomorrow to find our way to a football tornament in Palmerston North tomorrow.

I'll take some photos and post up here in the next day of two. I can now get all the boot trim off the spare bed and into my car which will make my wife happy!.

Lot of thanks to Hotwire who hs proides guidance, technical adice, and even tested my navigation set up after i boiught it, and before i took delivery. I've enjoyed this project and will now have to work out what my new one will be.

Exhausts through the bumper, H&R springs, transmission fluid flush are all on my wish list.

Edited October 25, 2010 by jimbo

[Alexa 0]

Hey mate, really good review. I was thinking to do the the same but never did. Just got some questions, how did you wire up the reversing camera and which one did u use?

and by removing your stock amps, did your sounds working all good with no lag? i mean does it turn off sometimes by its mind?

Thanks

[matt45 1]

Hey mate, really good review. I was thinking to do the the same but never did. Just got some questions, how did you wire up the reversing camera and which one did u use?

and by removing your stock amps, did your sounds working all good with no lag? i mean does it turn off sometimes by its mind?

Thanks

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/C...n-355631641.htm

sold by Grant (hotwire) on here.

[jimbo01 0]

Hi all. Havn't been on here in a long while. Almost sold the Beemer so ripped out the amps and crossovers. That was about a year ago. Car currently without sounds as didn't reconnect old wiring however thats a blessing as I am about to connect it all up again.

Got one issue I need to sort though - I think I broke the wire for the boot closed sensor getting the video cable and power cable through from the boot lid to the boot for the reversing camera. Not looking forward to finding and repairinf that but have to as without it I keep getting an alert that the boot is not closed and of course the auto opening doesn't work as it doesn't un lactche the boot coz the computer thinks its open.

Suggestion would be to try using the reversing lights power source for the reversing camera rather than running a separate cable.

Making up some speaker covers and installing the upgrade door speakers once all the amps and crossovers are back in. Will be looking to upgrade the 4:3 screen for a 16:9 screen at some point if I can find a replacement.

Jimbo

[hotwire 352]

Hi all. Havn't been on here in a long while. Almost sold the Beemer so ripped out the amps and crossovers. That was about a year ago. Car currently without sounds as didn't reconnect old wiring however thats a blessing as I am about to connect it all up again.

Got one issue I need to sort though - I think I broke the wire for the boot closed sensor getting the video cable and power cable through from the boot lid to the boot for the reversing camera. Not looking forward to finding and repairinf that but have to as without it I keep getting an alert that the boot is not closed and of course the auto opening doesn't work as it doesn't un lactche the boot coz the computer thinks its open.

Suggestion would be to try using the reversing lights power source for the reversing camera rather than running a separate cable.

Making up some speaker covers and installing the upgrade door speakers once all the amps and crossovers are back in. Will be looking to upgrade the 4:3 screen for a 16:9 screen at some point if I can find a replacement.

Jimbo

Jim,

Have myself fitted/wired a couple of reversing cameras in E38's - had no problem to run the cable through the conduit in the boot hinge - easier than running throught Touring tail gates . Also, seem to recall you having issues finding the power supply - that too located where I thought it would be in L/H corner.

Finding/fixing the broken wiring should be easy enough:-

[jimbo01 0]

Jim,

Have myself fitted/wired a couple of reversing cameras in E38's - had no problem to run the cable through the conduit in the boot hinge - easier than running throught Touring tail gates . Also, seem to recall you having issues finding the power supply - that too located where I thought it would be in L/H corner.

Finding/fixing the broken wiring should be easy enough:-

Hey Grant - hows things? Been out tracing wiring and looking at the online BMW wiring diagrams. There is something very strange going on. My car is a December 1999 E38, facelift, BUT the wiring in the boot lid appears to be pre-facelift based on the wiring colours. There are a number of wires going through the conduit that appear to be double ups, i.e. the same colour wire is there more than once (and not just the brown earth wires). There are also too many wires, which may explain why the conduit was such a tight fit. There are a number of wires that have been reconnected as the joints are covered in shrink-wrap. I'm thinking WTF but using the pre facelift diagrams I have identified the offending wire; a gray/brown wire from the S205 rear lid swtich that ends up at the General module.

[jimbo01 0]

Got the amps re-installed tonight and tested. Now just need to connect the power and earth.

Going to tackle one of the door speakers this weekend. My replacement speakers are huge so not sure exactly how I'm going to get them to fit in the sealed enclosures, or even if retaining these is a good idea. The other option would be to mount on the door pannel, use some dynamat, and use infinate the free air / baffle. Thankfully there are decent youtube videos on how to remove the door panels and replace the speakers.

[jimbo01 0]

Got the amps powered up tonight. Major step was pulling the inner door trim off the front passenger door to get at the speakers.

I've removed the tiny little mid range and tweeter from the top of the door trim and am installing the tweeter where the mid range was.

Have modified the heck out of the plastic mount that came with the Pioneer tweeter and will hot glue it into place tomorrow. Will trial fit after that to check it's going to fit but basically it's suck it and see.

New mid woofer needs about a 15mm spacer. I'm not going to be able to leave the stock speaker grills in pace as they have nasty plastic bits protruding in that would damage the rubber edges of the new speakers. Thinking of cutting a hole in the door trim so the speaker pokes through and then use the Pioneer speaker cover. Alternatively I'll remove the exisitng speaker grill and just bolt the Pioneer grill to the trim with the heads inside the door. They will be outside the diameter of the rubber so shouldn't casue a problem.

Edited August 7, 2012 by jimbo

[jimbo01 0]

Finished the passenger door. Getting the door panel off on these is easy, and getting it back on easy too. Amazed as tweeter is quiet a bit bigger than the old midrange, and new woofer speaker is mounted on a 18mm MDF spacer I made tonight. I fully expected issues.

I re-used the old foam seal that goes between the original speaker and the door panel but I think it's contacting the rubber edges of the new speaker due to the spacer so I'll pull the door off and trim it back. Had to pull the door panel off again anyway to replace 4 door clips which Smith and Smith Galss munted when they replaced the window glass.

Doing the next door will be easy now I know what to do so i'll take a few more picks and add a new topic covering replacing / upgrading a front door speaker in an E38.

If Abtec come back to me with the answers I need (that it will accept line level inputs) I'll buy this to give me iPOD connectivity, and control over the sub level etc. As it comes with a remote it means the kids can skip the music they don't like without me having to do it.

Edited August 9, 2012 by jimbo