ETS - a quiet protest.

[Yamahoo 6]

I've just emailed my local National MP, and John Key, to inform them that I will not be voting for them ever again, due largely to the implementation of the ridiculous ETS scam that is to be introduced tomorrow. Just remember when you fill up your car tomorrow at the new increased price, that of the billion or so this tax will raise annually, $64,000,000 is going to the Harvard University Endowment Fund in America because they own a share of the trees in the Kaiangaroa Forest. This $64 million increases to well over $100 million in a couple of years. NZ cash exported offshore to wealthy university professors in the USA because our govt has figured out how to tax us for breathing.

[kingkarl 136]

to inform them that I will not be voting for them ever again,

[39KiwiTouring 2]

They say things are getting better, I wonder when any politician has spent an afternoon walking Carlyle St Napier, Devon St New Pymouth, Rangitikei St P North, called in on the business's there and asked how the economy is doing.

Absolutely rooted will be the general response, oh O.k time to put everything up in price can't believe it where do these people at the top get their ideas from, I believe NZ emitts 0.001% of the words carbon emissions.

[fuzyfrog 0]

Yeah cause having Labour back in would be an improvement

If National doesn't get another term im outta here to a country not full of idiots and beneficiarys

Also the economy is doing fine. People are still buying luxury items.

Would love to see how people coped if we had a real recession not a made up media based recession.

Edited June 30, 2010 by fuzyfrog

[*Glenn* 854]

Yeah cause having Labour back in would be an improvement

If National doesn't get another term im outta here to a country not full of idiots and beneficiarys

Also the economy is doing fine. People are still buying luxury items.

Would love to see how people coped if we had a real recession not a made up media based recession.

+1.. the ditch is only a 3hr drive

[soarer260@hotmail.com 0]

Ridiculous scam alright.

It makes me laugh that the leaders of NZ think they are doing good getting into this disastrous scheme in the name of 'man made global warming'

After all USA and Australia aren't anywhere near putting one in place because they know it will upset their economy too much.

But ohhh no, not in NZ it's passed right along to the tax payer on the same wage from years ago before gas went up, food, insurance, water, power, rates, registration, postage, and now GST.

Quite pathetic.

[Docile 64]

hardest hit would be families who are already struggling... those who previously were only hanging on are now going to go under.

edit: so thinking of going over the ditch as well. but the costs associated with it is quite huge as well.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Docile

[nath 130]

I adore NZ- I love the boating and the fishing and all that, but honestly when I get my 2 engineering degrees, I'm heading for the Middle East, or some such.

I too, am sick of NZ imagining that it can become a 'world leader' in anything big- or not realising how it will cripple itself when it is.

[kingkarl 136]

Also the economy is doing fine. People are still buying luxury items.

Would love to see how people coped if we had a real recession not a made up media based recession.

That might be the situation for you, but it's not for a LOT of people still.

My parents have lost a very significant chunk of their manufacturing business due to the economy and are not doing well at all.

We have countless friends who either have their homes for sale (not by choice) or who are out of work. My parents get probably 20 people walking in to their business every week with their CVs. Some of them have applied to 200+ jobs (Mcdonalds included) over the last year without so much as a courtesy phone call.

sh*t is bad. Especially in Tauranga.

[Nobimmer 694]

I agree with this.

Apart from the top part... I just cant delete it on this POS computer.

I adore NZ- I love the boating and the fishing and all that, but honestly when I get my 2 engineering degrees, I'm heading for the Middle East, or some such.

I too, am sick of NZ imagining that it can become a 'world leader' in anything big- or not realising how it will cripple itself when it is.

[39KiwiTouring 2]

I too would like to think that the economy is doing well, there are of coarse some sectors, industries and quaters whom arn't affected. I would say vehicle repairers, accountants especially insolvency based and divorce lawyers. As Karl said the realty down at sea level is quite different, I walk and talk to people busness owners all over, not stuck in the same environment dealing with the same clientele day in day out.

Take it from me it is tough as nuts and I know where Australia is

[kerry 10]

im hearing you ther karl my little bro cant even get a job washing cars or scraping fat, the work is gone.

[soarer260@hotmail.com 0]

hardest hit would be families who are already struggling... those who previously were only hanging on are now going to go under.

Exactly, must be a nightmare.

[jonomayo 0]

You may say we are doing ok now and that is all thanks to National but thats all wrong. With some rudimentary economics knowledge its more than obvious that our comparatively good economic position is thanks to Labour. Years of no tax cuts and budget surpluses have helped to set us up for a crash such as this and it would have provided a better buffer had Prime Minister Don (John) Key not promised, and delivered some of, a package of unrealistic tax cuts pushing us worse into financial hardship and government debt.

So thanks to you who 'wanted a change' you got one, from prosperity, or at least as close to it as we had, to hardship....

[DRTDVL 0]

With some rudimentary economics knowledge its more than obvious that our comparatively good economic position is thanks to Labour. Years of no tax cuts and budget surpluses have helped to set us up for a crash such as this and it would have provided a better buffer had Prime Minister Don (John) Key not promised, and delivered some of, a package of unrealistic tax cuts pushing us worse into financial hardship and government debt.

So thanks to you who 'wanted a change' you got one, from prosperity, or at least as close to it as we had, to hardship....

You know the ACC debacal right? Something like 5 Billion dollars in debt while under Labour?

It was Labour that signed upto the Kyoto Protocol expecting to make a 500 million dollar profit, but because they screwed the maths up the country was going to be 500 million dollars worse off?

You know that Labour wanted the ETS but with twice the fee's???

National inherited a LOT of problems, factor that in with the economic downturn and i don't think they have done that badly.

[pureboiracer 0]

You may say we are doing ok now and that is all thanks to National but thats all wrong. With some rudimentary economics knowledge its more than obvious that our comparatively good economic position is thanks to Labour. Years of no tax cuts and budget surpluses have helped to set us up for a crash such as this and it would have provided a better buffer had Prime Minister Don (John) Key not promised, and delivered some of, a package of unrealistic tax cuts pushing us worse into financial hardship and government debt.

So thanks to you who 'wanted a change' you got one, from prosperity, or at least as close to it as we had, to hardship....

have a read of the new budget. you will see that although the acts of previous govt MAY have slightly reduced the effects of the recession. their budget scheme and finance dealings prevented a large amount of inflation that would have been very benificial when the economy was in its boom state.

i think that some of you guys are taking this all a little to seriously..

its not just as easy as flicking a switch and geting out of the recession.

there is alot more to govt dealings, polititions, bills, etc than meets the public eye. so just keep an open mind about it all.

i think a few people on here are very opinionated about this when the truth is they dont really know all that much about the goings on of a head of state or a govt. this leads to biast and one sided opinions which arnt always true.

Edited June 30, 2010 by DRTE30

[1rotty 40]

This thread is about the ETS.

Its bulls**t !!

End of story

Edited June 30, 2010 by 1rotty

[crshbndct 0]

lol

humans put out less than 2% of the worlds carbon

and how does tax make carbon go away?

[kingkarl 136]

This thread has the potential for infinite pages.

Politics + the economy + climate change + tax = recipe for endless debate

lol

humans put out less than 2% of the worlds carbon

Yes, human Co2 emissions are small compared to nature's, but read the below article and you'll see that natures emissions and absorption balance out. Human contributions disturb the natural equilibrium.

http://www.skepticalscience.com/human-co2-...l-emissions.htm

and how does tax make carbon go away?

ETS taxes increase the price of petrol/electricity/diesel/coal/jet fuel etc. An increase in the price of any normal good leads to a reduction in the quantity demanded for that good (economics 101). So more tax = less petrol etc consumed/burnt so less carbon emissions.

If the system was perfect (which it far from is), all the tax from the ETS would go towards environment spending/cleaning up pollution, but we all know that won't happen.

[cliffdunedin 8]

Also the economy is doing fine. People are still buying luxury items.

Would love to see how people coped if we had a real recession not a made up media based recession.

I would like to know how you think this "made up" recession(you speak of) has forced hundreds of millions of people worldwide into debt and bankruptcy.

Perhaps the other 5 billion odd people in the world are living it up!?

IMHO National has inherited a bad deal, i didn't vote for them last election but think that are doing a good job...ETS is a farce, like others said were miscalculated by Labour and an attempt to pull more votes...

Labour had my last vote for a while a year ago!!

[fuzyfrog 0]

I don't disagree that parts of the world , USA , Europe are most certainly in a recession and heading into a depression.

But NZ is fine, Our banks are not in the position that European and American banks are in. Only people i know who are affected are people who had large amounts of debt to begin with.

If you buy a house with next to no deposit or tick up a thousand items on HP with no interest then you are setting yourself up for failure.

And even country's like America where the "recession" is "really" bad, Apple sold 3 million iPads in 80 days so the money is out there.

[cliffdunedin 8]

If you buy a house with next to no deposit or tick up a thousand items on HP with no interest then you are setting yourself up for failure.

And even country's like America where the "recession" is "really" bad, Apple sold 3 million iPads in 80 days so the money is out there.

The trouble is Finance companies and banks were giving out unsecured loans and mortgages to people, thats how initially the collapse of banks like RBS began, if this had not been going on for the past decade, things would have been no where near as bad!

3 Million ipads not a great example thats less then 1% of the US population!! Of course a single percent is going to have expendable income for a few new toys