IR>RF key conversion for E46 with problems...

[rf_key 0]

I'm trying to follow the instructions at 

http://bimmersport.co.nz/topic/50157-diy-e46-retrofit-infrared-to-radio-frequency-remote-control/ ,

without doing the hands-on work myself - it's too long that I did such things myself. 

I found an Auckland-based key specialist, and he said he could do it within an hour. So I got an antenna amplifier 6906074 sent from Latvia through Ebay, but the key workshop tells me it is wrong: It certainly does work with RF, but still needs a battery. I however wanted the diamond-shaped key, ie the one that doesn't need a battery, because it is charged inductively. 

According to 

http://de.bmwfans.info/parts-catalog/E46-Sedan/Europe/318i-N42/L-N/dec2001/browse/audio_navigation_electronic_systems/single_parts_f_antenna_diversity/#6906074_2 ,

6906074 should be the right part. Would anyone of you be able to resolve these contradictions, plus reveal the solution?  

 

[Gabe79 410]

I think you're speaking at cross purposes. Any key needs a battery, full stop. The BMW Diamond shaped key charges off the coil around the ignition where the key rests.

 

Your car probably does not have this feature, but even if it does... moot point, unless you are ordering the key from the dealer. The aftermarket keys that cost $15, and work perfectly well, do not use that system anyway, using a watch battery instead.

[andyb184 7]

thanks for chiming in Gabe...

also, as far as the part# and 315Mhz or 433Mhz freq.....it doesn't really matter which one you'll get, especially with most cars coming from Japan. What's more important is, do you have a bmw business radio or similar and wish to keep full functionality? In that case you'll need 6907123 (433 Mhz) or 6907124 (315Mhz) ...again your choice

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by andyb184

[Gabe79 410]

13 minutes ago, andyb184 said:

thanks for chiming in Gabe...

also, as far as the part# and 315Mhz or 433Mhz freq.....it doesn't really matter which one you'll get, especially with most cars coming from Japan. What's more important is, do you have a bmw business radio or similar and wish to keep full functionality? In that case you'll need 6907123 (433 Mhz) or 6907124 (315Mhz) ...again your choice

 

Adding to this a bit further... them aftermarket keys have multi frequency remotes, so 315, or 433, it doesn't matter at all. 

And thinking about this further... I doubt you'd be able to buy an original Diamond/RF key for your car as your car didn't come with that feature equipped in the first place...

[rf_key 0]

Thank you, but I don't really know what to make of it. It sounds as if you all were deducting credibility from the forum thread mentioned, and also this one

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1047612 (the 1st post)

Both seem, among others, to say 2 things:

- Amplifier 6906074 seems to be right;

- using a diamond-shaped key does not seem to pose any problems.

So I tend to believe them. Seen from this perspective, the question would be why the key workshop told (and kind of showed) me that 6906074 would not support a diamond key - and of course, which one would? (And another one would be, why are you kind of refuting these earlier statements?)

 

[Gabe79 410]

45 minutes ago, rf_key said:

Thank you, but I don't really know what to make of it. It sounds as if you all were deducting credibility from the forum thread mentioned, and also this one

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=1047612 (the 1st post)

Both seem, among others, to say 2 things:

- Amplifier 6906074 seems to be right;

- using a diamond-shaped key does not seem to pose any problems.

So I tend to believe them. Seen from this perspective, the question would be why the key workshop told (and kind of showed) me that 6906074 would not support a diamond key - and of course, which one would? (And another one would be, why are you kind of refuting these earlier statements?)

 

What has anyone written on this thread that deducts credibility from the link you posted? 

Could you explain exactly what you mean when you say "Would not support a diamond key?" A Diamond key isn't some magical key. I can code a transponder chip on a diamond key for you right now, it would start your car just fine. Your IR > RF conversion relates purely to the remote control side of the key. The hangup seems to be that you want a key that charges from the ignition coil, like the original BMW diamond keys do. I honestly don't know if that would even work for you, I don't know if your car has that coil or not... This is an entirely moot issue though, unless you're going through all this effort to convert from IR to RF, to ask BMW to make you a key? 

If you just want the cheap aftermarket diamond keys to work, don't worry about charging via the ignition coil...

 

EDIT: Check this out 2003 E39 Diamond Key Charging

Edited December 14, 2017 by Gabe79

[rf_key 0]

I said it earlier: I am not an expert. I just have a certain degree of technical understanding, and otherwise apply what I would call logical thinking. 

Is my impression incorrect according to which all of you deduct credibility from the conversion manual in this forum? He says/shows there that 6906074 is the right part, but the workshop denies it. He said that a diamond key is unproblematic, you deny it.

I had assumed that what is written there is right, and after having read it, it seemed clear that I just need a car key specialist and the right receiver (or antenna amplifier, is the official title), and then this would be done within an hour. 

Now, mysterious and unexplained problems arise. If you are willing and able to relate to the problem as described by me, then you are most welcome to help me find the solution. Otherwise, it just seems like wasted time. Wouldn't you agree?

 

[hotwire 352]

Reading this, you ^^^^^ are the one confusing the issue & very vague in your description. What the others have said is consistent & makes sense.

[rf_key 0]

I do not categorally exclude having missunderstood something. I just want to see what it is.  .)

 

[hotwire 352]

Sorry, I'm on a different page then. As you were:-

[Dogballs 115]

rd_key,

1. the antenna amp you got (6906074) WILL work with a 433mhz key. 

But to change to this amp, it requires a power wire, a ground, and a signal wire to be added as your car with IR does not have the wiring for it.  It means running additional wires from the C pillar to the fuse box and body (GM) module. 

2. Your car has already has the ring antenna at the key barrel to charge the a diamond key. 

But you require a key that is rechargeable. Not all copies are rechargeable, but some are - you must search carefully for the correct one. 

You then need to either pair the new transponder keys to the car OR you can remove the chips from your IR keys and put them in the new RF keys, that way you won’t need to reprogram the EWS (security) module. 

The RF learn procedure requires no special equipment etc, it’s just a sequence procedure.. 

I have done this mod myself and got 2 new recharable keys, a new antenna amp, and keys cut for less than $200. - I did the wiring etc myself and I have a ak90 key programmer. 

You can have both IR and RF systems working together. Ie 1x IR key as a spare and a RF key as your main key. 

Any questions please ask. 

Edited December 16, 2017 by Dogballs

[rf_key 0]

Thanks man. I had reached this same conclusion in the meantime, by re-reading the web-based manual, and by evaluating the answers obtained in other forums.

The one thing that I don't understand is: Why would a specialised workshop lie to me? They claimed I had the wrong receiver. And why would forum members allege that my car wouldn't support a diamond-shaped key?

 

[Gabe79 410]

This is news to me you can remove the RFID from the original, is this true for all original keys, or just the IR keys?

1 hour ago, Dogballs said:

You then need to either pair the new transponder keys to the car OR you can remove the chips from your IR keys and put them in the new RF keys, that way you won’t need to reprogram the EWS (security) module. 

Edited December 16, 2017 by Gabe79

[andyb184 7]

On 12/16/2017 at 10:30 PM, Gabe79 said:

This is news to me you can remove the RFID from the original, is this true for all original keys, or just the IR keys?

Dogballs is correct, the transponder doesn't care what key blade it belongs to. The only drawback is that you are sacrificing a key to make another key.

[Gabe79 410]

2 minutes ago, andyb184 said:

Dogballs is correct, the transponder doesn't care what key blade it belongs to. The only drawback is that you are sacrificing a key to make another key.

I have had little exposure to IR keys. Is this true for the diamond BMW keys as well? Can the transponders from those be removed in the same way?

[andyb184 7]

8 hours ago, Gabe79 said:

I have had little exposure to IR keys. Is this true for the diamond BMW keys as well? Can the transponders from those be removed in the same way?

no, the real diamond key has the transponder (10030A ELMOS) attached to the circuit board.

[Gabe79 410]

2 minutes ago, andyb184 said:

no, the real diamond key has the transponder (10030A ELMOS) attached to the circuit board.

Sweet. That is what I thought. Thank you.

[Dogballs 115]

2 hours ago, Gabe79 said:

Sweet. That is what I thought. Thank you.

That’s not really the thing you should be worried about..

it’s the ak90 device that reads your key in about 10seconds without opening it... 

& anyone can order one off the internet..

[Gabe79 410]

Just now, Dogballs said:

That’s not really the thing you should be worried about..

it’s the ak90 device that reads your key in about 10seconds without opening it... 

& anyone can order one off the internet..

I have one.

What exactly are you suggesting anyone should be worried about? Read my key all anyone likes... 

[Miko Lizazi 0]

On 12/16/2017 at 10:18 AM, Dogballs said:

 

But to change to this amp, it requires a power wire, a ground, and a signal wire to be added as your car with IR does not have the wiring for it.  It means running additional wires from the C pillar to the fuse box and body (GM) module. 

2. Your car has already has the ring antenna at the key barrel to charge the a diamond key. 

But you require a key that is rechargeable. Not all copies are rechargeable, but some are - you must search carefully for the correct one. 

You then need to either pair the new transponder keys to the car OR you can remove the chips from your IR keys and put them in the new RF keys, that way you won’t need to reprogram the EWS (security) module. 

The RF learn procedure requires no special equipment etc, it’s just a sequence procedure.. 

You can have both IR and RF systems working together. Ie 1x IR key as a spare and a RF key as your main key. 

Any questions please ask. 

Hi Dogballs, I know this comes after such a long time but I have a convertible from Japan with the dreaded two gummy buttons IR key and wanted to convert to RF, is it possible and how do I go about that?  I don't know if convertibles have the same antenna as saloons or use something else (Perhaps the rear view mirror) as a transmitter. Do I need wiring to change from IR to RF or something else? I have searched and couldn't find anything on convertibles.  Really appreciate your help.

Edited December 19, 2022 by Miko Lizazi

[Eagle 1664]

You are correct about it being the the mirror, you'd need to replace that with the 433mhz version. Not sure on wiring side, may need a diagram.