BatmanMW

@BM WORLDhi mate, do you import these or something? seen you list a few, i'm not interested in this particular listing but could be in the right 335i white exterior black interior, m sport. do let me know if you have something that suits. cheers!

that's really funny you say that because i just had a really weird brain wave when i woke up this morning along same lines haha. i really must seem all over the place - deep down inside i'm still very resistant and fighting the eco urge, i still got that desire for true enthusiast car and finding it hard to resist bmw inline 6 goodness before i settle down. early morning 'lightbulb moment' went something like this. "hmm there is no way i could go back to a car that has half the power of what i've been used to driving with for so long such as the 123d. 335i are really cheap up front cost these days, compared to for example the 335d it's 10k cheaper and with less k's on it so.. the lower up front cost might actually offset the extra in fuel. the lower k's may mean less $$ spent on maintenance over my time of ownership and because i'm spending less up front, i'm also not standing to lose as much in depreciation." (kinda sounds like an addict trying to justify going back to whatever he quit :P) in my recent research some of the bigger downsides of diesel vehicles seem to be that the ones in my budget (15-20k) are higher in the odometer so being a good citizen who has decided against dpf removal, i'm very likely to be spending a great deal in DPF replacement soon after getting a diesel car which further chips away at my petrol savings. this all relates back to what @Olaf was saying about higher cost of entry / higher servicing cost of diesels negating the potential savings. have heard great things about the 335i and the direct point injection in terms of how efficient it can be (among obviously the many other awesome benefits of that car which i just know i'll fall in love with!) . there are mixed reviews about economy, in theory if it gets average of around 10L/100km then I'm potentially still doing ok as long as car is not a lemon. will see what i can sort in the way of test drives this weekend and see if any particular vehicle sways me one way or the other. the old Subaru was just very highly tuned (240wkw out of stock 2L 4 cyl engine that was up to 180k and almost 20 yrs old) , very old and because it had an old school style of power (big laggy turbo) i had to rev it up to 5k to get that big turbo hit (the car enthusiasts dopamine fix) to really get any fun out of it so my driving style didn't help me there. it was just dead anywhere without boost, in hindsight the stock turbo would have been better left untampered with but i was just chasing power back then. one of the biggest things i'm looking forward to on the Bimmers is how much earlier those turbos spool up. currently this ones got my interest but its jap imported so no full service history https://www.trademe.co.nz/a.aspx?id=1659845014

yep that's one of those only in auckland issues i guess re. public transport working out to be more expensive than driving in. also the bus lanes are a lie, my areas bus was in news some time ago as it's one of the few 'express' bus suffers from taking longer than normal bus due to being stuck on motorway.. i agree it's not right to compare it like that without including other car related costs but ultimately my decision is made that i'll drive in and no longer bus in so just looking to reduce my commute cost as much as possible.. it's one of those initatives i really wanted to beleive in about auckland transport but i'd rather drive and save myself 3 hrs a day as felt like i was missing out on so much of my personal time after work. agreed doesn't take much to skew it, overall the real data i found on fuelly based on users who have done 100+ fillups each logged about 6.6L/100km average which is not as eco as the stated 5L/100km for the 123d. this makes it $365 more than my calculated value but the offset for all the cars would be about the same as they're all in real world not as cheap per 100km than stated as their test is constant speed on highway with mild acceleration. since any given manufacturer would measure their own cars to the same standards, using this data for my personal calculations provides a good baseline for comparison (well thats my theory) given i'm trying to find the most suitable deal for me within the BMW line of vehicles. what's fairly funny is how a wide range of bmws performance vehicles are quite a lot more efficient than i would have previously assumed. for example you can see vitz here http://www.fuelly.com/car/toyota/vitz vitz 2009 average 7.6L/100km.. albiet with cheaper 91 so maybe the maths offset isn't as bad when you turn it in to $ per km, but given how slow a car that is i would have expected significantly better. 2009 123d at 6.7L/100km average. http://www.fuelly.com/car/bmw/123d and finally 335i seems not that far off , however it is using premium fuel so won't work out economical choice for me anyway http://www.fuelly.com/car/bmw/335i yup still waiting to hear back from Joe but i've almost ruled out the 335d now. given the target audience of bmw is usually performance (i was attracted for same reason), it's not that easy as it seems to find people willingly talking about owning a diesel haha, not even online. their tank sizes are different but in my calculations i done the maths based off 50L of fuel preceisely rather than each cars individual tank range as that would introduce additional variables.

no it's really okay, we need people in society to be very straight forward about issues like this. after all i'm sure we all love NZ and a good part of why the country is so great is that it still has a relatively clean/green image which can easily be destroyed if we just prioritized our own needs over the overall good. if anyone does have spreadsheet of real data i'd be keen to see it. i should probably start a fuel consumption thread as i did back in clubsub haha. if there's a chance i can pay not much extra and drive a fun high revving petrol car with decent average commute cost then you can bet i will do this - nothing against diesel at all! i don't mind paying the extra when i'm driving hard as that is well warranted and in that occasion i deal in smiles per gallon, it's mainly the city driving in traffic / motorway driving at 70-110kph efficiency that i really need. is it still true about the higher servicing costs on diesels? anything specific to look out for? i thought all these modern ones have relatively similar service schedules and maint costs. i've never personally known anyone at all to own a diesel so just judging based on what i've read online which i hope is not misleading, but y'know theres so much misinformation out there!

i'm open to this discussion and suggestions around alternate performing petrol cars, especially since you've already been down this road. have heard fair few people say this but based on my rough calculations i can't seem to figure out how petrol supposedly comes out cheaper, but maybe i'm missing something which i'd be interested to hear as have never owned diesel vehicle before. what i was looking at is in my price range in 'eco' vehicles, there is no such decent horsepower petrol car and so diesel almost wins by default as though it wont offer high hp, it offers atleast torque which can feel nice even though doesn't equate to moving you quickly. yes the rising fuel prices are indeed a concern and may not end up doing too many performance mods (if any at all) as a result especially if impacts emissions by heaps. have asked Joe about that for research purposes and overall budget reasons. @Olaf thanks for keeping me in check, my concerns are exactly that, hence asking around about it and if anyone has actual measured emissions numbers on record. not super keen to be spitting poison out my car so absolutely agree if those are legit concerns then won't be removing from my vehicle just for minor gains in power. in terms of the maths, just measuring them all based on 50L tank for range for sake of simplicity. when i see below, i see that by owning an eco diesel over the next 4 years vs my just sold car or something almost as thirsty (like the 335i), i can save an extra 10k over that period (which to me equates as 1-2 weeks of extra overseas holiday in every year in real terms, or just faster paid off mortgate). for example a 123d would comfortably get about 1000km to a 50L tank @ 5L/100km = 50x1.29 per litre = 64.50 + RUC @ 62 per 100km = total 126.50 for 1000km. $0.1265 per km which I think rivals hybrids? average yearly milage about 9,000 km = $1138.50 fuel cost including RUC. fuel over approx 4 years of ownership (average time i expect to own car for) $4554 335d at 8L/100km , 625km to a 50L tank of diesel + RUC = 126.50, $0.20 per km. average yearly fuel cost inc ruc 1800 4 year fuel cost 7200 my old car at 19L/100km average 260km from 50L tank x 2.26 per litre = $113 (may as well live at the petrol station right? lol) $0.43 per km. 3870 yearly fuel 4 year fuel cost 15480 bmw 135i at 9.6L/100km, which i'd only use 98 petrol on, 520km out of 50L tank (though i do find it hard to beleive..) $0.22 per km 1980 yearly fuel cost $7920 4 year fuel cost bmw 335i 15L/100km, 330km (wouldn't buy this car for fuel economy because its fun car but included for sake of comparison) $0.34 per km $3081 per year $12,327 per year when you add the cents per litre argument in to the mix, it just favours small diesel like 123d even more because the kilometres per litre is superior. i know that i might be bias or have some tunnelvision here so open to suggestions in flaws in calculations. the most obvious flaw i see is that i'm comparing my old cars actual measured value over 2 year period ( i used fuelly) vs figures for the other cars which i found online, which is really bias against my old car (hey it helped me move on :P) and favors all the newer ones. my other factor is that because of increasing price with my car i do tend to borrow more boring eco/diesel cars for longer road trips , id much rather drive my own - something i enjoy etc. so if i get a car that handles okay and still eco then my driven k's would go up by maybe another 2000km per year (so not just mainly commute) which would again favor diesel a lot more. edit : really sorry for thread jacking. i wonder if this discussion should be moved to my topic here. thanks for contributions so far, it's really good to have other peoples perspectives. i should also state that currently being quite frugal i was taking the bus for the past 14 months or so. this means sacrificing approx 3 extra hours (vs driving in) of my personal time each day. that bus service costs me $2200 a year using the discounted price via AT card. if my math is right about the 123d then i'm saving about $1061.50 on driving vs bus which goes a significant way towards paying for parking

Hi all! You may recall my thread from October last year when I was putting some serious thought in to getting rid of my old modified STI (240wkw at the time) and moving on to a 335i or 550i... well times have changed and the car is gone . I couldn't bring myself to do it back then but the car has been sold this long weekend already and now i'm in the market for a Bimmer again but criteria has changed somewhat (blame it on my old age? :P) . My old intro thread with bit of info of the old car and why Cars i'm currently looking at are 2009 123d coupe and 335d 2009-2011. I'm pretty new to the BMW market so quite open to suggestions. The choice will mainly be driven by budget, ideally i'd spend as low as 15k which allows a little budget for mods / tuning (this price range puts me in for a very stock 123d that's done maybe 60,000km based on what i seen on TM), or I could end up blowing the budget and going for a 2011 335d which has 100ks on the clock at around 25k (ideally wouldn't want to spend this high as no budget for any tune / mods / funds for emergency maintenance etc.) Some criteria : Budget is approx 20k at upper limits but could splurge for something special Ideally well below 100,000 km Preferably white or black in exterior colour with black or red leather interior My driving style is described i guess as a little sporty. i don't care too much for straight line acceleration but i do love to throw my cars or bikes around corners so you could say i'm more interested in soemthing that can handle well (or be modified within reason to handle really well). I have driven manuals for the past 13 years but wouldn't mind moving on to an auto box if it's not completely terrible.. i take it given the ratios on diesel vehicles that you would be mad to get a manual anyway. Looks good (i'm really liking the looks of the 1 series coupes but 3 series its pretty cool too) Decent performance, I know for my budget i won't get the kind of power i'm used to but that's fine, i'm accepting a loss in power as my goal is now shifted to fuel economy given i need to commute on the cheap and can't rely on bus services. Prefer things like early torque rather than all out top end performance. This is an area where both of these cars i'm currently considering will absolutely beat my old petrol car. Looking forward to my next ride whatever it may be. Cheers guys!

thanks guys, will have a chat with Joe about it also. it's a bit wierd but i'm really having a hard time choosing between a 123d and 335d at the moment. main reason for moving to diesel was fuel economy issues with my commute but with 123d being 10k+ cheaper than the 335d, it provides a fair sum of budget for modifications / tuning work which i'd inevitably do on either car. what is the general consensus here on egr/ dpf removal/disabling? has anyone ever had theirs emission tested ? im slightly worried about impact to wof but more so whether i'd then be driving around spreading ridiculous toxic emissions.

@shizamdid you ever get this done OP? Looking at similar solution in Auckland for 335d (haven't purchased it yet, wanna budget the costs in to my purchase so i know what im up for) . would like to get def, egr and dpf delete along with proper retune

thanks for the advice guys. i couldnt bring myself to part with the STI , my heart was still in it after all haha. i just changed a few 'racecar' things to make it more comfortable/quieter for my every day use.

ok thanks mate appreciate the advice and didn't mean for it to sound like i was insulting you or BMW by any means. This thread is about me getting my head around moving on to the BMW world from what I'm used to and also in part to investigate if it is actually feasible for me to do so. I was specifically inquiring about BMW (and more specific to e60 550i maint costs), not generic AA estimates, rego, insurance or anything else that applies as a blanket overhead to any/all motorvehicles - you are right when you bundle all that up it's not that big a deal! i was just scared because i thought you meant simple oil / filter changes and such will cost me $2.5k a year - this i did not expect, haha. This thread is not about Subarus but to clear any rumors or misunderstandings there, you'll be surprised at how low maintenance a Subie not owned by some boyracer kid can be. Unabused, this particular model I have cost bugger all on maintenance as has had all modifications done professionally and after market ecu installed to properly dyno tune it rather than download some generic flash tune off internet as most would do (though this unfortunately also applies for BMW as i see shops offering generic flash tunes on those in NZ too). They do get a bad rep because they're highly accessible so you get the young crowd that wind up the boost, perform significant upgrades without properly dyno tuning vehicle and later complain about how it blew up. Yes they do have cambelts unlike the N62 which has chainbelt but the cost is nothing worth writing home about, it's $1k (inc. parts and labor) every 80,000k's or 6 years, whichever comes first. Regular oil changes are about $250/yr at the local mechanic, even though i don't drive much i change mine 3-4x a year and just do it myself as when I do drive it, I drive it quite hard so i like that peace of mind. Sparks don't have to be changed that often when your vehicle is tuned properly and you are running the right fuel in it to suit that tune. When I do have to change it, i'll just do it myself, it's not annoying but not difficult . In all seriousness even if the poor motor blew up, i could get a brand new Ej207 motor to replace for $2.5k NZD figure at which point most owners decide to 'build' the motor so it's ready to push more power when it goes back in. Having got the above out of the way, my reason for moving on is not financially driven in the purest sense, if it were i'd just sell car and not have one at all - barely need one for the little driving that i do. I just want to make sure that when i get one, i can treat her right and won't be constantly paranoid about something blowing up.

nah haven't gotten to drive yet. still looking around for the right one. if that includes tyres then that's a big releif, what else is that 2.5k/yr generally made up of? including the road trip here and there i drive about 5,000 km a year at most. think i only done about 2,000km this year. i would be quite gutted to drive that little and be spending too many hundreds (or even thousands) on basic maintenance.

heh these are not big displacement cars, the turbo is what brings them to life (which i'm sure same can be said about a fair few of BMWs fine inline 6 racing engines) and for anyone who loves a sporty ride there is a lot to appreciate about the boxer engine. didn't come here to bash subaru nor will i ever. my car has been a real thrill to own and i'm glad i could tick that off my checklist. if i'm completely honest here i'm fairly put off by that annual total servicing cost figure given by @Olaf. i appreciate the honesty there, if that is the true cost of ownership then i may have to wait a few more years until i climb the ranks at work as the last thing i want to do is be 'one of those guys' who buys such a fine car then leaves it broken down in garage because couldn't afford to maintain or repair it. it does explain why they depreciate so quickly around that 100k mark.

true mate in an ideal world i'd probably have both , but not quite at that level yet financially. i fully expect that i will not be able to throw these cars around corners the way i do my STI but i don't yet know to what extent. i've added an alert on trademe so that i'll get email notification for any 550i that comes up from now within my budget. looking out for one in white with black leather interior. im finding myself on the fence a lot but i reckon when the right one comes along, i'll fetch it in a heart beat any ideas roughly how much i should budget for these please? car really is purely for fun for me as i take the bus to work (expensive city parking!) during the week. if the servicing prices are exhorbitant then might fail my feasibility (though somehow my car got to the stage it's at so my feasibility obviously is not very strict lol)

haha people at work also recommended the 335i, i don't blame em cos looking at the specs, it does meet that description i put up. i researched it a bit and its a really nice sport car but i think im pretty set on going for the 550 for now just to see what all the fuss about v8s is about. on paper the 335 looks absolutely amazing though, the fact that it hits a very good peak torque at only 1300 rpm then holds it til about 5000, thats something i'll have to test drive at some point to figure out

hey everyone thank you so much for being so welcoming and providing so much information. i'm definately a lot less scared to approach the bimmer market now and i'm coming much closer to decide on a car (90% decided i want e60 550i). about the options - i have a lot to learn, recently discovered bimmer.works site so i will check the options there when i find one. also thanks for linking those TM suggestions. there is an amazing looking 540i in white with black leather, that's pretty much exactly what i want except i want its bigger brother the 550i.. https://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=1439618447 now i'm being a bit picky but i'm going to keep looking until i find the 'perfect' one in white/with black leather. also agreed with the point about getting a professional to check it, to be honest it would be my first auto car ever in my life so i would have no idea while test driving how to determine whether something is just normal or if it is indeed faulty. it is interesting to read about that transmission, is this the standard 'auto' transmission (zf6) or do i have to look for one with a certain package to get it? i do get the whole thing about falling in love with the car and embracing that it'll be pricey, my subaru is kind of like that in the way that i feel like i need to regularly modify it and in a way by going for a nice comfortable and powerful bmw i was hoping to curb that temptation (i most likely will, as i'd be too scared to modify bmw which would probably void any mechanical warranties i purchase). are there any common items in this regard that people do which void such mechanical warranties? for example i would quite religiously maintain it but certainly not via an official bmw dealer, i would likely change oil/filter myself or take to local mechanic at a relatively low cost. this 550i really is a beautiful car and though i'm still very much in love with my current car, i'm falling more and more in love with getting one of these too! for now i'm just looking within auckland but if i don't find my ideal car within a couple months i may look out of town. it sounds like i may not escape the 'sports car money sink' phase but at least i'll be driving in comfort , and dare i say, in something that better suits my age