Options, electricians maybe?

[QuickSilver 0]

Sighting the recent topics of internet speeds in the OT section I thought I would start to investigate mine. The result I had posted in that section was from a while ago, haven't had the chance to test the home connection until now; I've just run a test which is current and have edited my post accordingly.

I am with Orcon, using their ADSL+ services with a 50GB bandwidth limit. When I first joined I was getting a fairly consistent 8 - 9MBPS down, and always (never changes) 700 - 800KBPS up. At some times my router even reported 12 - 14MBPS.

My router reports as follows:

Downstream rate: 6228 kbps

Upstream rate: 1020 kbps

Maximum line rate: 6204 kbps (downstream) / 1276 kbps (upstream)

Noise margin: 5.7 dB (downstream) / 16.6 dB (upstream)

Line attenuation: 31.3 dB (downstream) / 16.1 dB (upstream)

My maximum line rate is completely in-consistent. When on the occasion it has spiked, (and I dont mean a momentary increase in download speeeds, this will "spike" for an hour or two) the router has declared that the line rate is infact much higher. The line rate is only ever as fast as my speed is.

Speedtest.net reports the following:

When running speed test it will absolutely NOT go past 5.35mbps. It reaches this at a flash, and seems as though its capped off.

Using the new Pingtest.net I am getting very good pings, and it is reporting I have a very good line.

The reason for this detailed break down? I have come to the conclusion that by all reasonings, my speed should be faster, surely? I have acceptable line attenuation, indicating I am not a huge distance away from the exchange. I'm using a very good router, (Orcon home hub, which is infact a Siemens) AND my line seems to be in good shape. (minimum noise, down at least)

I haven't contacted Orcon about this yet as I thought I would just ask a few questions here. I'm not disappointed with their services, I find their CSR's quite helpful and there's minumum outages for me.

I am keen to get faster speeds as there are games I'm struggling to play online like MGO, where for some reason they have categorized NZ with the Europe gaming regions, I don't get fast speeds here, let alone international speeds.

So what should I do? Is there anything I can try on my end before I start emailing Orcon? Am I correct in assuming I should have faster (at least slightly) speeds than what I am currently seeing? I know its capable/possible but it seems I've been capped, and these speeds are ADSL1 speeds.

The other issue I am wanting advice on. Earlier in the year we had SKY TV installed at our house, they did their usual stuff, and also installed another phone jack to plug the decoder into. In order to do this they COMPLETELY massacred the original phone jack that they used. (It had to be opened up, and another line now runs from it half way across the lounge to a new one near the decoder) I haven't really looked into it until now, as I am investigating my internet, I would like to use this jack for my router, as its about 2 rooms closer to where the router is now (bedroom) The computer is in the lounge. The router is in the bedroom because none of the other jacks (including the one for the sky decoder) will work.

Am I within my rights to call sky and have them fix my jack(s) free of charge? I also cant order movies through the decoder etc etc.

Any advice, info would be great. I'm paying for ADSL2 and getting ADSL 1 speeds, and have had sky butcher phone jacks in our house. What to do...?

Edited November 9, 2009 by QuickSilver

[Wom 0]

If you're paying for line maintenance then it should be free to get fixed (think of it as insurance for your phone line),

but they will charge you if it looks like you have intentially damaged stuff.

So best bet would be to give your telephone provider (does Orcon do their own, or is it through Telecom?) a call to discuss and explain what the Sky guys did and they should explain whether it's going to cost or not.

If it's going to cost, then I'd suggest calling Sky and getting them to sort it out.

[QuickSilver 0]

Ah, that would work, but I am on Orcon Purple+, I dont have a home line. Using contract cell phone so having a homeline would be surplus.

[Wom 0]

ah ok then

I'm thinking contact Orcon first and see what they have to say

if I had to take a guess I'd say it's the dodgy wiring that Sky has done

but you want to narrow down the issue before contacting Sky ... which Orcon will be able to tell you if it's your end or something wrong with their exchange

otherwise if you call Sky first, they'll just say, "nah call Orcon, something's wrong with their side of things"

[DRTDVL 0]

you have to look at a lot of other things also.

Number of people on the line, usage on the line, etc...

Also do you get a different level of connection speed at different times? I.E. on and off-peak times?

We had a massive problem at my old work where the line was damaged although it worked fine until a certain load was placed on the line and at which it would drop. The line when tested was within telecom's acceptable limits and was not workable.

Things to try would be a different router, differance account if you can (they have a few options like extra line checking on the account which will reduce speed - or account restrictions - although they say they don't)

Talk to orcon.

[QuickSilver 0]

Thanks for the above comments. I will soon be talking to Orcon, in regards to Heath's comment, things like load on the line, just myself and occasionally a laptop ( browsing only ) speeds are consistant no matter what time of the day, peak or off peak. I will try the other steps after I've contacted Orcon.

[DRTDVL 0]

sorry when i was referring to the line i was thinking from the exchange to your house... not within your house...

the number of people connected to the same line you are (i.e. the line you connect to the exchange with) will effect your connection. i very simple terms each line only has a certain about of data it can contain more people connecting to it the less you will get...

Think of it like a water pipe with other pipes running of it... the pipe can only handle a certain amount of water, everyone before you will take some water some more than others leaving you with whats left...

It's part of the reason why some ISP throttle peer to peer / torrent downloads during peak time when everyone wants to surf the net... the peer to peer apps suck so much bandwidth it doesn't leave much for everyone else.

[antil33t 90]

I use to get 4000kbits max line rate, then I installed a Splitter (goes at demarcation point) get 10,000 max line rate constantly.

Maybe your houses wiring is just old? however 5mbit is pretty good... some people get much, much less on "max" connections.

[Creaver 55]

If sky stuffed up your internal wiring, you will be charged.

Wire Maintenance (the 'insurance' against internal wiring faults) only covers deterioration etc etc

I guess from this point you could chase up sky to pay this bill though if you have proof

In regards to Wom's question - Orcon is a wholesale company through telecom. You report your fault through Orcon then telecom gets one of their service companies techs to attend.

Those speeds should be more than capable of playing games adequately. Your ping to the servers in europe on the other hand would be your problem

Edited November 10, 2009 by Creaver - STOK3D

[Wom 0]

sorry when i was referring to the line i was thinking from the exchange to your house... not within your house...

the number of people connected to the same line you are (i.e. the line you connect to the exchange with) will effect your connection. i very simple terms each line only has a certain about of data it can contain more people connecting to it the less you will get...

Think of it like a water pipe with other pipes running of it... the pipe can only handle a certain amount of water, everyone before you will take some water some more than others leaving you with whats left...

It's part of the reason why some ISP throttle peer to peer / torrent downloads during peak time when everyone wants to surf the net... the peer to peer apps suck so much bandwidth it doesn't leave much for everyone else.

that's why I love living where you can get cable, can handle so much more "water" than telephone lines

[QuickSilver 0]

The frustration I have is that I can't play in any over seas servers without getting a huuuuggeee ping. The closest I can play with acceptable ping (average 170 - 190) is freakin Australia!

I dont know whether or not the issue lies with Sky, as the internet does work, and works fairly well.

Are these the speeds I should be getting? Or SHOULD I be getting higher speeds?

[Gaz 1060]

Splitter

This.

Whenever you have Broadband you need filters on every jackpoint that has something plugged in, eg phone, Sky to help 'clear' the line the reduce noise on the line and get better speeds. Installing a splitter does the same job as the filter but works alot more effectively.

Whenever you connect Broadband it is recommened that a splitter is installed to give greater speeds even if you don't have Sky or a monitered alarm on the line.

Orcon could it for you but I'd imagine it would cost in the $200 range.

[antil33t 90]

Telecom do it for 150. - I assume they will do it for you if you have a land line with them.

and you get an awesome dedicated ADSL jack

[DRTDVL 0]

have you unplugged the sky box from the phone line????

you don't "need" the phone cable plugged in to run sky digital, my sky or my ski hd.

Unplug the sky box from the phone jack and see if it improves... if it does then unplug your main phone remove the filter, and plug that into the phone jack where the sky box is, plug the sky box in to the phone jack and see if that improves it.

If it does then go buy a $14 splitter/fliter from tricky dicky and use that...

Anouther note: physical distance to the exchange don't mean jack poo with the actual line distance to the exchange... It all depends on how the cables been run... Old work was 400m from the exchange box but we where 4.9km away from the exchange in line length.

Edited November 11, 2009 by DRTDVL

[Jamez 2147483647]

The frustration I have is that I can't play in any over seas servers without getting a huuuuggeee ping. The closest I can play with acceptable ping (average 170 - 190) is freakin Australia!

I get lower speeds than you, but my ping's kick ass

My line stats are

................Down/Up

SNR Margin 9, 12dB

Line Attenuation 43, 27dB

Data Rate 4613, 791kbps

I would say most of it depends on the exchange and if you want a low ping, just get interleaving turned off

[QuickSilver 0]

I get lower speeds than you, but my ping's kick ass

My line stats are

................Down/Up

SNR Margin 9, 12dB

Line Attenuation 43, 27dB

Data Rate 4613, 791kbps

I would say most of it depends on the exchange and if you want a low ping, just get interleaving turned off

THIS is what I'm talking about, when I pinged the states I got between 500 - 600MS.

900+ In Europe.

Heath, I have unplugged the sky box. (As its not currently using a splitter) Unplugged, reset the router, no difference. There's only two other jacks in the house, one working one with the router plugged in. Spliter obviously used. And the other stuffed one, that has been used to run the dedicated sky jack. I don't have a home phone so I can't unplug anything else, with the sky box unplugged the only thing remaining is the router. I'm about to plug a splitter into the sky box. I DO however have an alarm, and I have absolutely no clue if this will tie into the phone lines...

I cant get past the way the speed test runs, within the first split second of hitting "test" it shoots to 5.35 and doesn't move not one iota.

Just writing an email to Orcon. Trying to word carefully as I'm not yet at a "disgruntled" point, merely a bit frustrated.

What is interleaving and where do I throw mine?

Edited November 11, 2009 by QuickSilver

[Creaver 55]

The alarm could play a huge part in your speeds also if it is connected to the phone line.

To remove interleaving you need to speak to the ISP and ask them to remove it. This should increase ping by a fair bit.

[QuickSilver 0]

Can someone clarify what interleaving actually is/does?

[Jamez 2147483647]

Basically it stops burst errors on bad phone lines, but it is not needed if your phone line is good (not 3rd world)

Because it only affects ping, all ISP's leave it turned on (as default) as most of the customers wont notice, but all the gamers I know have it turned off so that ping's are lower thus giving less lagg.

Explanation from Wiki

Interleaving is used in digital data transmission technology to protect the transmission against burst errors. These errors overwrite a lot of bits in a row, so a typical error correction scheme that expects errors to be more uniformly distributed can be overwhelmed. Interleaving is used to help stop this from happening.

Data is often transmitted with error control bits that enable the receiver to correct a certain number of errors that occur during transmission. If a burst error occurs, too many errors can be made in one code word, and that codeword cannot be correctly decoded. To reduce the effect of such burst errors, the bits of a number of codewords are interleaved before being transmitted. This way, a burst error affects only a correctable number of bits in each codeword, and the decoder can decode the codewords correctly.

This method is often used because it is a less complex and cheaper way to handle burst errors than increasing the power of the error correction scheme.

Edited November 11, 2009 by Jamez

[e30ftw 410]

Sorry to hijack but seeming as this is where the topic is headed..

Is it just a matter of calling your ISP and asking them remove it off your line ?

Will it be obvious if you have a bad line and have it removed, adverse effects ?

[Jamez 2147483647]

some ISP's don't turn it off, It's just a case of asking to turn it off.

It will be obvious if you need it back on, games will be more laggy if your line isn't up to it.

Edited November 11, 2009 by Jamez

[QuickSilver 0]

Are there drawbacks? Will my speeds go down and ping goes up for example? I get good download speeds, that's not my issue, the difficulty I'm having is I am unable to game, even as close as Sydney my ping is too high.

Have emailed Orcon, waiting for replies ATM.

[Jamez 2147483647]

no drawback's at all.

but if your getting ping issues to start with i'm guessing its something to do with the exchange.

[Gaz 1060]

Is your alarm monitered? If so, when it goes off, it calls the alarm company to say 'hey I'm going off' which they then do something about. If it's not monitered, then it won't be an issue. Seeing as you don't have a phone line then I doubt its monitered.

[diablo23 1]

anyone know how to bypass telecoms big time bandwidth shaping i heard it can be done ?