Any Good Trust Lawyers?

[twiggles94 8]

As titled, anyone have any personal experience or know any decent lawyers with trusts that won't rob me for my kidneys?  I am in East Auckland area and looking to form a family trust.  

From basic research the ballpark seems to be around the $3K mark for formation and extra per property transferred etc.  Of course price isn't the only factor as  the trust deed drawn up will govern everything but I do think my situation and needs from the trust are fairly simple and straightforward.  

Would love to hear any general advice, comments or experiences even if not directly related to trust or law firms in Auckland! 

[B.M.W Ltd 950]

The Best........Rhonda Graham - Morgan Coakle Lawyers

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2132]

Fee to set up mine was half of that, and included transfer of not only property but other assets too. 

Definitely worth doing, I have had so many mates burnt by ex partners, in one case a wife, 

I don't know your personal circumstances nor do I want to, but if the reason you want to set one up is because of a relationship is about to break up, the trust offers no protection if the courts decide (rightly or wrongly) that the sole intention of setting it up was to avoid what would otherwise be your obligations. This can also extend to when completed just before entering in a relationship or if the time is right for them to move in etc, depending how good their lawyer is. It is also very important to set up any payments that flatmates and/or partners pay towards upkeep of the asset or the household (e.g. bills), as they MUST be structured correctly. 

[gjm 3258]

13 hours ago, _ethrty-Andy_ said:

Fee to set up mine was half of that, and included transfer of not only property but other assets too. 

Definitely worth doing, I have had so many mates burnt by ex partners, in one case a wife, 

I don't know your personal circumstances nor do I want to, but if the reason you want to set one up is because of a relationship is about to break up, the trust offers no protection if the courts decide (rightly or wrongly) that the sole intention of setting it up was to avoid what would otherwise be your obligations. This can also extend to when completed just before entering in a relationship or if the time is right for them to move in etc, depending how good their lawyer is. It is also very important to set up any payments that flatmates and/or partners pay towards upkeep of the asset or the household (e.g. bills), as they MUST be structured correctly. 

I know an accountant who has no money. Everything he has/does is Trust-related, something (unsurprisingly) his practice specialises in.

Good bloke, knows his stuff. I suspect there are tax advantages, but don't know anything about that.

Completely stiffed his ex-wife when they broke up - she got virtually nothing whatsoever because it was all in the Trust, and he'd not named her. (As far as I know he went a bit off the rails and she had no choice but to leave.) I don't know all of the details post-breakup, but suspect (given Andy's comments) that she needed a better lawyer.

Edited March 15, 2018 by gjm

[twiggles94 8]

On 3/15/2018 at 3:09 PM, B.M.W Ltd said:

The Best........Rhonda Graham - Morgan Coakle Lawyers

Glenn any particular reason for your recommendation?  Have you personally had dealings with that partner or know her?  

23 hours ago, _ethrty-Andy_ said:

Fee to set up mine was half of that, and included transfer of not only property but other assets too. 

Definitely worth doing, I have had so many mates burnt by ex partners, in one case a wife, 

I don't know your personal circumstances nor do I want to, but if the reason you want to set one up is because of a relationship is about to break up, the trust offers no protection if the courts decide (rightly or wrongly) that the sole intention of setting it up was to avoid what would otherwise be your obligations. This can also extend to when completed just before entering in a relationship or if the time is right for them to move in etc, depending how good their lawyer is. It is also very important to set up any payments that flatmates and/or partners pay towards upkeep of the asset or the household (e.g. bills), as they MUST be structured correctly. 

Yeap I definitely agree they are worth setting up, pity not so many people are aware of the benefits of having one.  I have heard of such cases you talk of, often those people make their intentions even more evident to the judge by setting the trust up with themselves as the sole trustee and beneficiary..  Thankfully I am in none of the situations mentioned above and hope I won't be there.  Legitimate reasons for setting up, namely to state my part ownership of a soon to be purchased property, tax advantage and of course asset protection. 

What do you mean in terms of the payments?  Just keeping track of what they have contributed if any towards the property/asset?  Is that because they can make an argument for a stake based on their contributions e.g. mortgage repayments/renos etc?

Also do you mind if I ask how long ago you formed yours and with what firm?  Or are they based out of Akl?  I am guessing you have been happy with them so far?

10 hours ago, gjm said:

I know an accountant who has no money. Everything he has/does is Trust-related, something (unsurprisingly) his practice specialises in.

Good bloke, knows his stuff. I suspect there are tax advantages, but don't know anything about that.

Completely stiffed his ex-wife when they broke up - she got virtually nothing whatsoever because it was all in the Trust, and he'd not named her. (As far as I know he went a bit off the rails and she had no choice but to leave.) I don't know all of the details post-breakup, but suspect (given Andy's comments) that she needed a better lawyer.

Funny you say that Graham as I'm an accountant myself.   That's in no way my intentions at all and I would not feel right about doing such a thing if the assets were rightly jointly owned i.e. acquired during the course of a relationship or with joint funds, but imo it's more than fair to protect what is wholly yours from the start.  I see people getting robbed of their lifetime's hard work and savings all too often just from getting in bed (literally) with the wrong people. 

The main tax advantage comes from income splitting/distributing to gain lower tax rates from beneficiaries with less or no income but if you mention anything about 'income splitting' ird will try get you for tax avoidance, a more acceptable term to them might be 'tax planning'. 

[B.M.W Ltd 950]

I have had Rhonda look after all our legal stuff since the early 90's. When and if you meet her you will see why. She is currently managing the sale of my building for me . She is a no nonsense battler you would want on your side all the way and she knows her stuff

Edited March 16, 2018 by B.M.W Ltd

[twiggles94 8]

Excellent thanks Glenn. I will have to get in touch with her.

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2132]

Have done a lengthy PM to you