Hartge dyno results

[BM WORLD 1265]

did a dyno run on my 1990 535i , that i have recently fitted a semi rebuilt hartge engine in .

i built this engine up with a hartge tunned head ( bigger valves and porting) head is dated back to 1984 came from a 87/88 635i from japan .

i used block from a approx 89 535i or 735i , fitted 10:1 cr pistons from e23 86 735i , had new riings and bearings fitted , valave grind , both head head and block where skimmed .new chains and sprockets etc .std e28 cam

fitted it along with a 5 speed manual box into this 90 535ia 3.45 diff.

was a bit disapointed with the proformance when i got it all going , found a bit more power after changing fuel filter and also swapping ecu from a motronic 1.3(original one in car) for a modified 1.1 from a 87 735 e32, seamed a little better , still enquiring with enginer and parts people why is seams ro be down on power , decided to reset tappets a little loser after doing compression test and only coming up to 150psi ( should be 180+) .also rechecking cam timming noticed it looked at by one tooth , reset to true .

and all seams to be good now . havn't done another compression test , but should be alot better now .

dyno results show 4 different ecu's we tried , first run was the lowest with the modified unit from a e32 735i about 126kw at the wheels ,

then nest run with the original ecu that came with hartge engine came up to 132.9kw then 2 more goes with std 1.3 motronic ecu and 1.1 motronic ecu both better than the 735i one but not as high as the orginal one .

a friend of mine had his 86 M535i 5psd 3.07diff ,there on friday came up as 123kw (shrick cam and e34 head ) and another guy there witha 90 535is had 112kw (map sensor afm fited).

gavin who owns the place use to have a alpina B10 e34 that did 141kw , and also ahas a e30 335ia with fully worked engine with auto and 4.11 diff doing 158kw .

he said we could tune the ecu a little more to get the power to carry on andn maybe even up a little .

still have std exhaust and intake system ,

first pic is a few of the runs with different ecu's

second pic is the power and the torque

third pic is the fuel and power curves

132.9kw equals about 181hp at the wheels , add about 25% for flywheel rating 226hp .

std e34 is 211hp 305Nm std e28 is 218hp 310Nm .

mine was about 325Nm pretty flat

full hartge spec engine about 240Hp and alpina about 250hp ....

Edited February 5, 2007 by Brent HARTGE535i

[drifty325i 0]

Still not bad for an old girl mate! i can see why your having so much trouble getting it running right. have you thought about running a link computer Brent? it would improve things alot

[cainchapman 0]

Well done Brent. Beats working on a Monday!

Can't beat cubes for torque. I expected a bit more power from that motor.

I guess you'll need to keep an eye out for some Nos.

[330itis 15]

Sounds like a lot of work for 130Kw What are you going to do next?

Where did you get it dynoed and how much did that set you back?

[BM WORLD 1265]

have you thought about running a link computer Brent...

yes maybe , have looked at the mapecu system , maybe will take it back to gavin when he has the computer gear to be able to reprogramme the factory chip to suit the engine ...

I expected a bit more power from that motor......

remeber it still has std e28 type camshaft , no hartge extractors ,and a ecu thats not quite tunned for this engine as it is .

still have std exhaust sytem and air filter etc .

Sounds like a lot of work for 130Kw What are you going to do next?

Where did you get it dynoed and how much did that set you back? .........

yea seams that way , was hopping for a bit more ,

but remeber the std e34 535is was only doing 112kw....

maybe reprogramme ecu a bit , swap air flap meter for the map sensor type , maybe exhaust etc .

but remeber this car will mainly get used by my wife with the 3 kids for the school runs and shopping etc .

i still have the M5 engine to be fitted to the e28 M535i , that should do a few more numbers on the dyno ....... and its heaps lighter ....

cost $90 for the dyno testing , done by gavin bellars at Hi-velocity in glenfield..

[Andrew 30]

My racecar with less mods (albeit a Link) and 2.5 ltr is that power (185 at the wheels). I'd def look into an ECU

[BM WORLD 1265]

My racecar with less mods (albeit a Link) and 2.5 ltr is that power (185 at the wheels). I'd def look into an ECU

this engine is about the same as an e28 535i engine except for the hartge head and ecu thats tunned a little different .

std e28 535i has 10:1 compression ratio . 218hp / 160kw 310Nm . e34 has less cr ,hp and torque.

so i am reasonably happy with results , more than e28 and alot more the std e34 . , torque is up by 10-15Nm and power up by about 8hp .

but i know there is more to get from it with little bit more tunning etc . i could swap cam for a shrick etc and maybe swap afm for map system .

but the engine fells a lot more alive than other 535i's i have driven .

so what changes have gone on in your m20 engine ???

[BM WORLD 1265]

That's only 47.5 kW per litre which is less than your E36 325 at 56.8 kW / litre. Both run about the same compression so that is a bit light for all the work.

yes i think the e36 coupe will give the e34 a good run for the money , untill it comes to a hill .

had a bit of a drag race with my freinds e28 M535i up to 160km/h about the same then the e28 just pulled away .

e36 only just lighter than e28 by about 40kg .

yes i agree , but the 325ci m50 has all its torque up at about 4500rpm , 250Nm . has 10.5:1 cr.

where as you can see this engine develops max torque from about 2500rpm at 320Nm .

my e36 has been chipped also .

yes i know the m50 with twincam 4valve per pot is good .

i also have a M88 3.5L engine to go into my e28 M535i .

that engine has 210Kw 290Hp and about 340Nm ,60Kw per litre but its like the M50 its torque curve is higher up the rev range . the std M30 engine has more torque right through till about 4500rpm then the

M-power engine rockets up heaps all the way to about 6500rpm .

i think with a few mods like losing one of the 3 mufflers etc will help .

[p1_m3 8]

Keep going Brent - you'll get there. If anyone reading this thinks that it sounds like Brent has a lot of engines & cars laying around - you wouldnt be wrong there

You referred to remapping the ECU - can this only be done on older cars or can it be done on my S50 engine also? would there be any gains?

cheers mate

Edited February 7, 2007 by p1_m3

[BM WORLD 1265]

Keep going Brent - you'll get there. If anyone reading this thinks that it sounds like Brent has a lot of engines & cars laying around - you wouldnt be wrong there

You referred to remapping the ECU - can this only be done on older cars or can it be done on my S50 engine also? would there be any gains?

cheers mate

gavin is going overseas to buy some big computer unit that can read and then you can remap most chips . he said would be harder ( and take longer) for older ecu's like mine , but easier for newer ones .

call hi-velocity , glenfeild

[Andrew 30]

Just get gavin to slap a link in (or you could DIY).

Racecar has rasied compression from 323 head, lightened everything, gas flow head, custom equal length headers, removed AFM now uses MAP with Link ECU.

[BM WORLD 1265]

The link may be the under square Bore / stroke ratio. Looking at all the devlopments Alpina etc of the 535 they all are soft on torque gain but get good power gains up around 170kW.

I had a look at an Aplina 535 about 2 years ago and max torque was at 5,700 and max power at 6,500 it was not fun to drive as you had to thrash it to get it to go.

Perhaps you can reverse engineer some of the gains from the M52 engines to get bettre results e.g cam timing , induction etc.

yes main problem with the 34 is the weight .

std specs

e28 m535i 157bhp per tonne..

e34 535i 138bhp per tonne.. maybe mines around 150bhp per tonne

e36 325i 140bhp per tonne.. (my one has been chipped and more open exhaust ) maybe upto 147bhp per tonne

e28 M5 204bhp per tonne.. cant wait to do the m5 conversion in to the e28....