E30 engine swap options, and tweaking an M30

[Jacko 2154]

Heya,

Im going through the process of working out a budget (and how much OT I have to do to acheive it ) and am trying to find the best engine swap option for my NZ new 85 e30 M323i. The car has the Sport 5 CR 5 speed box and a high ratio LSD (2.4k rpm at 100k in 5th). I have access to a workshop with double post lifts and the works, and am pretty handy with a spanner, so plan on doing much of the work myself. As well as the engine swap the car is getting adjustable platform's, nolathanes, 17's and repainted the original colour, along with some panel beating/rust removal.

Ideally Id like to keep the gearbox (if possible) and diff as they are (planing on getting both overhauled, the diff is a bit whiney and the box is leaking at the rear seal). Id like to keep it BMW, and reasonably simple to do (not too interested in putting the amount of $$ and labour into a v8 conversion) so a six seems to be the best option - Ive done a bit of research into putting an m30 3.5 into it, and it seems to be resonably straight forward, but the gains arent really that impressive to me, an extra 50-60 hp and a bit more torque for a lot of work. How do m30's respond to tweaking? I wouldnt go whole hog and turbo it, but if I could see a reliable 300hp at the flywheel on a rebuilt m30 id be happy, would a remapped ECU (or possibly a plug in unit - ie a link if available), streetable cam and extractors get me the extra 90ish HP i want? Or am i better off playing with a later model twin cam vanos six? or is doing a proper turbo conversion on the m20 2.3 a better option? Ideally I wouldnt want to spend more than 4k, parts only, on the engine, but we know how these things are. I also have a mate with a MIG/TIG welder and a performance workshop who will do some nice fabrication work for a box of beer and a BJ

Thanks for any advice

Chris

Edited March 1, 2008 by Jacko

[tire 10]

I was looking at some Hartge E30's with the M5 s38b36 (H35-24 something like that), and there were a few comments about the increased engine weight spoiling the handling. ( click )

And I assume the M30 and s38 are similar weight.

So you may want to consider that when weighing up the M30 swap. What does an M50B25 weigh compared to a M30B35? The 20 odd more hp from the M30 may not be worth it..

Maybe you should consider the 96 328i engine from the E36 Brent is wrecking.

Best of luck!

[mr E34 11]

If your target is 300hp you will have to turbo the M30, good strong engine. N/A target is 250-260hp, still costs too much.

Tuned M30 in an E30 is pretty good, check out Alpina E30 B6S for specs etc.

Most powerful option is to drop in 4ltr M60 V8, all the engine development work done for you courtesy of BMW.

Ask Brent on Bimmersport.

M30 Alpina head work.

[Jacko 2154]

If your target is 300hp you will have to turbo the M30, good strong engine. N/A target is 250-260hp, still costs too much.

Tuned M30 in an E30 is pretty good, check out Alpina E30 B6S for specs etc.

Most powerful option is to drop in 4ltr M60 V8, all the engine development work done for you courtesy of BMW.

Ask Brent on Bimmersport.

M30 Alpina head work.

Cheers for the advice, after doing a bit more "googling", maybe buying an m20 2.5 rebuilding it and making a custom turbo install would be a good option, from what ive read 300hp isnt hard from this on surprising low boost, 7psi or so.

A lot of the information on the net seems quite dated and doesnt apply to NZ in terms of parts for doing it.

Has anyone done this from bimmersport? Id like to pick their brains, im not really too sure how reliable the bottom end will be at this power and Im pretty sketchy about how AFM systems work with turbo's, ive only played with map engines.

I think 4 grand should do for a budget for parts, Im sure my mate wouldnt object to throwing a few stickers on my car for some mates rates manifolds and intercooler piping, Ill hit him up for a bimmersport deal and see what he says . Is it a straight swap apart from ecu 2.3-2.5?

[mr E34 11]

Don't know how strong M20 bottom end is, i do know M30 can take it. I run piggyback map2 on stock M30 535is, no AFM.

[kiwi535 538]

it may only be 20 or so HP but it will be quite a lot of torque,and in a lighter car with a chip and cam and lighter flywheel it would be quite fun i think...the m30 is quite a big lump tho

[BM WORLD 1283]

m30 is a good option but hard to find 5spd manual boxes for them .

the 328i enginei have is a good option , 192 hp std but with a few mods (swap intake manifold for e36 325i/e34 525i one chipped ecu custom headers ) and you get 220hp plus and a revvy engine . fits up to M20 gearbox with some small mounts mods etc .

[*Glenn* 854]

I also have a mate with a MIG/TIG welder and a performance workshop who will do some nice fabrication work for a box of beer and a BJ

Hi there Chris. Would your mate be interested in doing some fabrication work on my manifolds ?? I'm doing a M30 swap at the moment. Check the thread under "My E30 335cc project" I have beer & money ...but I'll pass on the BJ or does that mean "beer & a joke" ???

Cheers

Glenn

[Jacko 2154]

Hi there Chris. Would your mate be interested in doing some fabrication work on my manifolds ?? I'm doing a M30 swap at the moment. Check the thread under "My E30 335cc project" I have beer & money ...but I'll pass on the BJ or does that mean "beer & a joke" ???

Cheers

Glenn

Im sure he wouldnt mind, might take a few weeks though as he seems to be pretty busy, shot around late last night to his workshop and he had cars piling up outside.... Give him a buzz - Tim TTT automotive in onehunga wk:9408887 mb:0212671793

Just saw your thread Ill be a keeping an eye on it What do you need fabricated?

Edited March 2, 2008 by Jacko

[mark247 39]

Don't know how strong M20 bottom end is, i do know M30 can take it. I run piggyback map2 on stock M30 535is, no AFM.

m20 bottom ends are pretty damn strong.

[*Glenn* 854]

Just saw your thread Ill be a keeping an eye on it What do you need fabricated?

Alloy inlet manifold for 6 X 40mm Yamaha R1 carbs and an air box

[Jacko 2154]

Alloy inlet manifold for 6 X 40mm Yamaha R1 carbs and an air box

BADASS!, that should make an incredible noise! I would say he would jump at it. He doesnt have much sheetmetal forming equipment (mainly tube stuff, most of his work is cages, ic plumbing and exhausts), so your airbox might be tricky, but if your after a sheetmetal ali one I'll happily do the bits he cant at work.

[Jacko 2154]

An m52b28 sounds like me! and its a good 20kgs lighter than an m20! http://www.e3024v.com/

I wont be looking at doing the swap for a few mths, panel and paint and suspension first. But it seems reasssonnably straight forward, and I can use my existing gearbox with modified linkages. One thing im not sure about - what the hell is OBDI? and do I want vanos or would an earlier engine be a better bet, vanos sounds a bit ho hum from what Ive read, but how dicky is it actually? KISS is a good motto for me . Whats the going rate for an m52b28, How quickly do you want to sell yours and how much are you after brent? PM me. In terms on an ecu/loom to use is the stock one going to be the best bet? or am i better off playing with an aftermarket option in the long run? keeping $$ in mind

Edited March 3, 2008 by Jacko

[mark247 39]

An m52b28 sounds like me! and its a good 20kgs lighter than an m20! http://www.e3024v.com/

I wont be looking at doing the swap for a few mths, panel and paint and suspension first. But it seems reasssonnably straight forward, and I can use my existing gearbox with modified linkages. One thing im not sure about - what the hell is OBDI? and do I want vanos or would an earlier engine be a better bet, vanos sounds a bit ho hum from what Ive read, but how dicky is it actually? KISS is a good motto for me . Whats the going rate for an m52b28, How quickly do you want to sell yours and how much are you after brent? PM me. In terms on an ecu/loom to use is the stock one going to be the best bet? or am i better off playing with an aftermarket option in the long run? keeping $$ in mind

If you want to turbo later on dont get a vanos engine.

[mr E34 11]

A little bit of info if interested in BMW engine mods.

http://www.eurotuner.com/techarticles/eurp...gine/index.html

or

http://www.dtmpower.co.za/forums/showthread.php?t=152

Edited March 3, 2008 by mr E34

[tire 10]

An m52b28 sounds like me! and its a good 20kgs lighter than an m20! http://www.e3024v.com/

I wont be looking at doing the swap for a few mths, panel and paint and suspension first. But it seems reasssonnably straight forward, and I can use my existing gearbox with modified linkages. One thing im not sure about - what the hell is OBDI? and do I want vanos or would an earlier engine be a better bet, vanos sounds a bit ho hum from what Ive read, but how dicky is it actually? KISS is a good motto for me . Whats the going rate for an m52b28, How quickly do you want to sell yours and how much are you after brent? PM me. In terms on an ecu/loom to use is the stock one going to be the best bet? or am i better off playing with an aftermarket option in the long run? keeping $$ in mind

Sounds wicked bro. Looking forward 2 it

[international 0]

A little bit of info if interested in BMW engine mods.

http://www.eurotuner.com/techarticles/eurp...gine/index.html

or

http://www.dtmpower.co.za/forums/showthread.php?t=152

Now that V12 E30 is dope...sure its losts all attributes of the supposed light chassis and good handling but its got a gut load of gunt on the rear treads!!!

[drifty325i 0]

"An m52b28 sounds like me! and its a good 20kgs lighter than an m20! http://www.e3024v.com/"

Ive got a feeling thats only the case if its the alloy block m52 (Z3), the iron block m52 is still heaver. Could be wrong

Edited March 3, 2008 by Drifty 340i V8

[Gus 5]

most M52s are in NZ are alloy..its about 30kg lighter as all the ancillaries are much lighter

great swap, expensive and not THAT powerful, but still one of the best 6cyl swaps I know of

[tire 10]

edit cause im retarded

Edited March 5, 2008 by tire

[Jacko 2154]

From what ive read the only cast iron blocks were only for a few years in US in the mid 90's, and then they went ali too.

[Brennan 0]

Now that V12 E30 is dope...sure its losts all attributes of the supposed light chassis and good handling but its got a gut load of gunt on the rear treads!!!

Have a look at this one.

http://www.bilforumet.no/prosjektforum/189...twin-turbo.html

[tire 10]

Have a look at this one.

http://www.bilforumet.no/prosjektforum/189...twin-turbo.html

Is there a way of translating that? My swedish or finnish or norwegian or whatever that is is a bit rough

[international 0]

Have a look at this one.

http://www.bilforumet.no/prosjektforum/189...twin-turbo.html

Yea obviously more grunt...enough grunt to make you swallow you eyeballs...

[kiwi535 538]

Is there a way of translating that? My swedish or finnish or norwegian or whatever that is is a bit rough

babel fish..it will still be half untransloated though