Weird... Starts intermittently etc

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

heya. tried starting the car today and it wouldnt do it. was right in the middle of xmas shoping grrr. Car is ex-auto so my first thought was those wires coming loose (the car has done it before and this fixed it). relinked them and nothing. checked the leads to the starter and they were sweet. tried starting again, nothing. Texted my mate to come tow me home (he works 5 ins away and would have been leaving at 12 anyway) and then straight after that cranked it and she started up. texted him not to worry and then set off home, and then the car lost power. because the car was rolling at 50, it sort of crash started itself and carried on going and i got home.

Any ideas? i would imagine these two ideas are linked. Master Relay? Bad ignition switch maybe?

[pureboiracer 0]

um, sounds like a loose earth or something to me, mabey even a dodgy ign switch.

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

um, sounds like a loose earth or something to me, mabey even a dodgy ign switch.

mm didnt think about the earth. (LOL) I have an ignition switch here so ill see how i go with that

 

Edited December 20, 2009 by pando

[kiwi535 538]

how old is the battery?

[*Glenn* 854]

On Topic.... get a reliable sparkie to check it out for you if your having trouble diagnosing the fault.

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

On Topic.... get a reliable sparkie to check it out for you if your having trouble diagnosing the fault.

yeah might do that. trouble is that it is very intermittent. sometimes it will happen, it will be fine for a week or more and then it will do it again. this is the first time that it has cut out on me though. On the plus side i have fixed my bad fuel economy now though, pity the two problems arent related as i though they might be :S

[hotwire 352]

yeah might do that. trouble is that it is very intermittent. sometimes it will happen, it will be fine for a week or more and then it will do it again. this is the first time that it has cut out on me though. On the plus side i have fixed my bad fuel economy now though, pity the two problems arent related as i though they might be :S

May have missed it somewhere, but out of curiosity - what was the story re fixing the economy issue?

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

Well i went out and brought an AFM and put that in, then i swapped the diff 4.45Open -> 3.67LSD, and while under the car i noticed the sensor in the cat had come out so i screwed that back in. Obviously the LSD makes a different being lower ratio, but its either the AFM or the Cat sensor that fixed it, or both. turns out my fuel gauge isnt working though either (i know because the tank said empty, took it to the petrol station and only put 20-30 liters in). Is a bad sender, the gauge cluster has just been rebuilt and i double checked everything and made sure the earths were tight

[pureboiracer 0]

my mate had this exact problem about 6 months ago.... the m52 fixed it....

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

my mate had this exact problem about 6 months ago.... the m52 fixed it....

Funny you should say that. i asked for extra hours at work over the xmas break when everyone is on holiday. I plan to M50 or M52 in the new year

[Carl 3]

I had an intermittent starting issue, when the engine was warmed up on the first try it would crank away but not spark, second try it'd start fine. Never died whilst driving. Then one morning the car wouldn't fire at all.

Was the CAS - Crank Angle Sensor, but there's a tonne of things to look into

Essential checking is does it crank (starter, earth, ignition wiring - inhibitors, alarm/auto)

Is it fuelling (fuel relay)

Is there spark (coil, CAS, master relay)

Edited December 20, 2009 by pando

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

I had an intermittent starting issue, when the engine was warmed up on the first try it would crank away but not spark, second try it'd start fine. Never died whilst driving. Then one morning the car wouldn't fire at all.

Was the CAS - Crank Angle Sensor, but there's a tonne of things to look into

Essential checking is does it crank (starter, earth, ignition wiring - inhibitors, alarm/auto)

Is it fuelling (fuel relay)

Is there spark (coil, CAS, master relay)

Everytime the engine cranks over she will start up so not a spark or fuelling issue. its sometimes when you switch the key to start nothing happens, except i hear a click like a relay tripping but nothing else. is there a relay for the starter motor? How do the wires to the auto shift selector (which are now shorted as part of the manual conversion) intergrate into this system to stop the car starting in drive? i should have investigated when i put my new dash in.

Edit: for the record i dont have an imobiliser.. i havent wired it up yet because it is just going to get in the way of sorting this problem

Edited December 20, 2009 by ethrty320

[*Glenn* 854]

Possibly voltage drop to the starter solenoid or a faulty solenoid in the starter. Check the starter with a volt meter when it plays up

Edited December 20, 2009 by *Glenn*

[Palazzo 438]

Everytime the engine cranks over she will start up so not a spark or fuelling issue. its sometimes when you switch the key to start nothing happens, except i hear a click like a relay tripping but nothing else. is there a relay for the starter motor? How do the wires to the auto shift selector (which are now shorted as part of the manual conversion) intergrate into this system to stop the car starting in drive? i should have investigated when i put my new dash in.

Edit: for the record i dont have an imobiliser.. i havent wired it up yet because it is just going to get in the way of sorting this problem

When you find it, post it up, I have a very similar problem in the 'vert. Sometimes turn the key and a click or nothing, keep trying and when it cranks, will start every time. Never cut out on the move though, so possibly different prob.

[Carl 3]

Read this NEWSLETTER around page 4

This isn't the PDF document I was actually after but would appear to have the same article in it that I was using

Will sticky this PDF

[*Glenn* 854]

Page 4 is a very good write up & accurate

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

Possibly voltage drop to the starter solenoid or a faulty solenoid in the starter. Check the starter with a volt meter when it plays up

Will carry multimeter in the car from now on

When you find it, post it up, I have a very similar problem in the 'vert. Sometimes turn the key and a click or nothing, keep trying and when it cranks, will start every time. Never cut out on the move though, so possibly different prob.

Will do

Read this NEWSLETTER around page 4

This isn't the PDF document I was actually after but would appear to have the same article in it that I was using

Will sticky this PDF

Thats an excellent resource im sure. ive saved it or future referance. M40 and M20 starters arent the same are they? i have a spare M40 one..

[tcbaurpower 5]

Hello.

I have been having the same problem with a manual so i don't think the auto switch would make a difference.

I used the guide to work out my problem is the starter. Thing is I have already replaced the starter once. Is this just bad luck or could something be destroying the starters. Also are all m20 starters the same eg do b20 and b25 use the same. Any idea on the cost of buying a new one as it is rather annoying to have this particular problem.

Cheers

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

Hello.

I have been having the same problem with a manual so i don't think the auto switch would make a difference.

I used the guide to work out my problem is the starter. Thing is I have already replaced the starter once. Is this just bad luck or could something be destroying the starters. Also are all m20 starters the same eg do b20 and b25 use the same. Any idea on the cost of buying a new one as it is rather annoying to have this particular problem.

Cheers

M20 starters are the same in facelifts, i dont know if prefaclift is any different i doubt it though

[Jono51 57]

M20 starters are the same in facelifts, i dont know if prefaclift is any different i doubt it though

m20 starters are different ,but can be inter changed,

prefacelift is larger, and terminal 50 is a spade connection

facelift is smaller and terminal 50 from the ignition bolts on to it.

so you need to muck around with the wires a little,

also some prefacelift had an additional bracket at the back of the starter, attached to the block for support

I've got plenty of starters if anyone needs one

edit; a common starter fault that I've seen is a loose connection when people do manual conversions and just twist together, rather than solder, the inhibitor wires.

also check the engine block earth strap isn't broken

and make sure that you have a good battery before any tests, don't assume, actually test the battery first

Edited January 2, 2010 by Jono51

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

edit; a common starter fault that I've seen is a loose connection when people do manual conversions and just twist together, rather than solder, the inhibitor wires.

as you know, this does apply to me. you mean the wires you need to connect make the car think its in Park yes? mine are twisted and crimped as i didnt have a soldering iron where i did the conversion and haven't touched it since. will look into that. come to think of it it never did this before i converted to manual...

[tcbaurpower 5]

I wasn't in the mood to change the starter again so decided to try cleaning all the connections first. So I filed down the inside of the battery connections and the terminals on the battery itself. Then moved to the fire wall connection and filed that down. And lastly jacked the car up got under and did the negative cable from the sump. All clean 'n shiny . And it fired up just like it should. Now just have to wait and see if it will play up again. (Touch wood.) Give it a go it doesn't take that long.

Edited January 2, 2010 by tcbaurpower

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

I wasn't in the mood to change the starter again so decided to try cleaning all the connections first. So I filed down the inside of the battery connections and the terminals on the battery itself. Then moved to the fire wall connection and filed that down. And lastly jacked the car up got under and did the negative cable from the sump. All clean 'n shiny . And it fired up just like it should. Now just have to wait and see if it will play up again. (Touch wood.) Give it a go it doesn't take that long.

yeah i leave to go on a road trip on the 12th, but have taken leave from the 8th so ill do all this then. will probably just change the starter to be sure. my friends are convinced the old girl is going to break down on us. I hope to prove them wrong

[antil33t 90]

I wasn't in the mood to change the starter again so decided to try cleaning all the connections first. So I filed down the inside of the battery connections and the terminals on the battery itself. Then moved to the fire wall connection and filed that down. And lastly jacked the car up got under and did the negative cable from the sump. All clean 'n shiny . And it fired up just like it should. Now just have to wait and see if it will play up again. (Touch wood.) Give it a go it doesn't take that long.

I diddn't reconnect my sump earth at all accidentally when I did my engine swap. Nothing happens

and you kick yourself for not noticing.