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jon dee

Interpreting log files (335i N54)...

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I'm just in the process of getting some decent logs. Today was just a half pull in 3rd to test that the MHD logging feature was actually working after having a few setup problems. The attached files show the same section of the log with different parameters graphed as this logviewer can only display eight values on a screen. In general things seem to be doing more or less what I would expect, but there is apparently a problem with cylinder one. Towards the end of the pull the DME pulls 3deg of timing, and I imagine this means that some detonation has been detected for that cylinder.

To keep the log size down I only logged timing on cylinders two and four, so I don;t know at this time if any other cylinders pulled timing. Question is... how significant is cutting timing by 3deg on just one cylinder ? Just a bit of carbon buildup or something more sinister ? Car is running MHD Ver.9 Stage 1+ tune on BP98. No codes. Would appreciate it if anyone who had had first hand experience with this issue could post up a bit of information on cause, importance and if need be, the cure :) General comment welcome also.

Cheers...

MHD logfile 20-10-24 01.png

MHD logfile 20-10-24 02.png

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Carbon buildup is very likely in your inlets, I had mine cleaned at 87k and the amount of crap in there was incredible. The car ran so much better afterwards. I now run a catch can and upgraded pcv.

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Indeed! Some vehicles become so gummed up it effects valve to seat sealing.

Had mine cleaned late last year, replaced injectors(index 12) at same time.

Ugly $$ price, but what a differance!! Car just flew, haven"t had any codes since.

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9 hours ago, Herbmiester said:

Carbon buildup is very likely in your inlets, I had mine cleaned at 87k and the amount of crap in there was incredible. The car ran so much better afterwards. I now run a catch can and upgraded pcv.

Interesting... my car is coming up on 89,000km and I don't know if it has ever had the inlets cleaned. I'll look into that. Who did you get to do yours (assuming walnut blasting) and what sort of money involved ? I actually have a BMS catchcan but after installing the BMS DCI cone filters there is no space left to install it.

What's the deal on the upgraded PCV... is that a factory upgrade or aftermarket part ?

Any way to inspect the inlets (or even one inlet) without removing the inlet manifold ? Probably worth getting the inlets cleaned every 50,000km or so just as preventative maintenance.

Cheers...

 

 

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The shop that did mine has closed down. Not sure who does it in welly now but tempted to do my own next time. Pcv is from RB turbo in the USA. I would ditch the DCIs they are not really worth it anyway. Better off with the catch can.

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Mine were chemically cleaned, A wuurth product I think.

Just takes a while to eat into carbon, end result is great!

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1 hour ago, Herbmiester said:

 

Have seen a few of there vids, they some how get by.

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29 minutes ago, smiddy said:

Have seen a few of there vids, they some how get by.

Did you see their vids on the effectiveness of carbon cleaning solutions? Not that good really.

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Yeah, i did. My guy uses some wuurth stuff, took hole day tho, can't see anyone moaning about this result.1230286398_N54335iPortCleanAfter.thumb.jpg.7b637ba48962d923a0a1fe84ff9882e3.jpg

IMG_3825.jpg

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3 cylinders at a time, leave for about 5hrs, suck with wet vac, finish with brake clean.

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LOL :D Yeah, I watched that video on cleaning with chemicals a few weeks ago. Got to hand to the guy, he got covered in sh*t blowing the chemicals out and they didn't work worth a damn, but he stuck with it long after I would given up :). When he eventually got his walnut blasting under control it worked better and quicker without the mess. I discovered a while back that CRC gasket stripper did a pretty good job of removing carbon from the combustion chambers of a head I was cleaning, but less than impressed with their stuff that was used for trying to clean the ports. The Wurth stuff might be more serious though. 

I'm going to do a bit of looking around to see who does a cleaning service in Wellington, what they use and how much it costs.

Cheers...

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Crappy kind of day so I thought I would generate a few more of these... I find them very useful in helping me to understand what is actually going on inside the engine. Seeing as the DME runs things as if there were two 3-cylinder engines under the hood it makes the logs a bit messy, and I have just selected a few different parameters for each graph for clarity. I discover that for reasons unknown, the TPS is pegged at 80% even though the pedal position runs to 100% ?? Is this because there is no worthwhile performance gain above 80% TPS ??

Gear changes have interesting effects on boost and timing and while wheelspin under acceleration results in power being reduced, wheel lockup under braking gets a little dab of the TPS without the gas pedal being touched :)  Being able to isolate sections of the log and display only the parameters that you are interested in comparing often makes it easy to see the cause and effect relationship when you are chasing a particular problem. Logs were very useful when I was chasing an ignition problem on my supercharged 4AGE as I could see where in the rpm range the engine was having difficulty in igniting the fuel.

Cheers...

20-10-25 sample fuel log 01.jpg

20-10-25 sample timing log 01.jpg

20-10-25 sample afr-trim log 01.jpg

20-10-25 sample load-gear 01.jpg

20-10-25 sample tps-pedal 01.jpg

4jxyeq.jpg

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With Valve cleaner the engine is ment to be up to temp and running when using the cleaner which helps break up the carbon deposits. 

 

Logs are great when you know how to read them haha!  Only car I have needed to learn how to read them
If you can create a datazap.me account and upload logs to that, makes it easier to share with others. 
80 TPS is normal I beleive, mine is 81. https://datazap.me/u/ninjaspartan/log-1603093603?log=0&data=3-21

 

 

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12 hours ago, Ninjaspartan said:

With Valve cleaner the engine is ment to be up to temp and running when using the cleaner which helps break up the carbon deposits. 

 

Logs are great when you know how to read them haha!  Only car I have needed to learn how to read them
If you can create a datazap.me account and upload logs to that, makes it easier to share with others. 
80 TPS is normal I beleive, mine is 81. https://datazap.me/u/ninjaspartan/log-1603093603?log=0&data=3-21

 

 

Yes Datazap is the way to go.

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Yusss.... I have a Datazap account and when I get the chance to make the recommended clean 3rd gear pull under ideal conditions I will post it up for analysis :) In the meantime I am using the logs I made during "racing" to get a better idea of what is going on under the hood and look for any obvious problem areas. When you are going hard out there isn't time to look at gauges or even watch the rev counter, so it's nice to be able to see how RPM, IAT and ccolant temps etc were going when you were busy driving :)

Cheers...

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Being a crap kind of a day I was playing with my log files... as you do :D Found a short 3rd gear pull I did a few weeks ago, graphed it and then loaded it onto Virtual Dyno. Tried it (actually a different file) on Datazap and I think my logviewer does a better job. Anyway, have attached the log file and the VD for the same run. I did this on a short level but not overly smooth bit of public road with a bend at the end. So I had to back off before reaching terminal velocity for fear of leaving the road and ending up in the creek.

The 335i E92 is already characterised in VD so all I had to do was add 100kg for driver and spare wheel in the boot. Back in the day when I first used VD you could select which of the major US dyno brands you wanted to emulate. That meant if you had done a real dyno run on a Dynojet, you could adjust the VD dyno to get closer to a typical Dynojet result. Only useful for arguments about which dynos read high and which read low. That feature has gone from the current version., so now you just get the basic VD dyno and that is good enough for comparing tunes if you have a decent test track.

Cheers...

201024 3rd sample 01s.jpg

201024 3rd VD graph 01.jpg

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All dyno graphs use smoothing to reduce the visual impact of fluctuations due to wheel slip and engine resonances. VD allows you to change the smoothing level to get the curves looking... how shall I put it... more in line with your expectations :) And as all computed power and torque dynos are calculated from from RPM vs TIME without the inertial smoothing of heavy steel rollers, some graph based smoothing is reasonable.

The attached graphs show the difference between zero smoothing and level 5 smoothing.

Cheers...

31095591_2010243rdVDgraph02.jpg.adfae90cb23eecd3d2d3bd06e8e95bd0.jpg

201024 3rd VD graph 03.jpg

Edited by jon dee
Typo

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Thats pretty cool! Not sure how accurate they are but I tried VD on one of my logs. 

I will be going to do a hub dyno this year (hopefully) to see actual figures but 500whp would be nice lol. 

image.thumb.png.b23f6e2abb17e614c928f99444169656.png

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Graph looks good to me :) Accuracy is reputed to be close to machine dynos. However given that there is considerable variation between the different brands of machines, the main use for VD is checking to see if your mods are working. Looks like you are riding on 17's and your car weight is a bit higher than I estimated mine to be. All of these factors need to be realistic because they directly affect the VD calculations. I need to get my car down to the local landfill to get an accurate weight of car with driver and spare wheel in the boot.

Looks like you got a good log to work with. So long as the torque curve is not dropping off and the revs are going up you are going to make more power. I'm hoping to squeeze a few more killerwasps out of mine if I ever get a chance to make a log that goes past 5000rpm :D 

Cheers...

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Thanks for pointing that out.

I just used the weight given by VD plus 200pounds for the driver. Looks like VD is a bit higher than what google says 3800 vs 3500.  Also I had wrong tire size 255/30/18. Should have been 255/35/18
Used a more recent log and i'd say 475hp is a more reasonible figure ?

image.thumb.png.300ea1d9427235e85832f2be86eba13a.png

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Nothing wrong with 475 :) You got a beautiful flat torque curve with level 5 smoothing... but that takes away a bit from the peaks if there are any humps in your power delivery. Try the same run with level 1 smoothing and you might pick up a few hp :D

Cheers...

 

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