dog box

[beema 0]

hi guys.

does any one know where i can find dog boxes, my gearbox sh*t itself. i heard they go for round 10k!!

can anyone help or direct me?

[Andrew 30]

What what kind of car?

If it is for a 318i why bother with the dogleg/short ratio box? You can easily find a replacement manual box for sweet bugger all.

[tibbs.james 1]

Why not rebuild the box ?

Sure it might cost around a 1 to 1.5 K but then you know exactly what you have.

[E30-323ti 66]

Do you mean a REAL 'dog box'??

I won't bother asking why.....

If so, there was a 4 or 5spd jerico on Trademe a while back.

Plenty on eBay in the US, hundreds of ratio's to choose from and cheap/quick to change ratio and rebuild.

Or there is Quaife, who do gearsets for many ZF boxes (?? about BMW cases though) or Holinger over in OZ.

Nothing cheap though and most scenario's will need a custom bell housing.

[lbirgel 0]

I have a dogleg box out of a M323

I have some one holding onto it for me in england. i was going to put it in my car but the shipping company has messed me around to much so im trying to selling it over there at the moment to get some money back.

probebly not what your after as its not in NZ but if you know how to get it over here for a a good price then it would be a good buy.

[jjs 60]

May I ask why you would want a dog leg gearbox? Surely the time shifting from first to second will be slower than a conventional setup

[Gus 5]

just get a 318 box - you don't know what a dog box is do you? 10k? are you mad?

[kerrynzl 3]

Just clarify what you are wanting.

A dogleg box [ which is the shift pattern of the BMW "close ratio" gearbox ]

or a Dog box [ a real fun non-synchro-smash racing gearbox ]

At $10K you are talking a race dog box eg: Quaiffe , Saenz , G-force , Hewland etc

a Jerico 5-speed is very rare

[beema 0]

here in AUS i was told that they were going for neally 10 thousand, there unbreakable i want a gearbox that can withstand alot of power since i am aiming to get big power from my car. Are there any other gearboxes that are just as good and not soo expensive??

cheers.

[beema 0]

just get a 318 box - you don't know what a dog box is do you? 10k? are you mad?

yer its an up-over-up layout, from first gear to second. Thats where it gets its name from because it resembles a hind leg of a dog!

[Gus 5]

you are talking about 2 different boxes

refer to Kerry's post above...a dogleg gearbox (for m20 or s14) is around 2-3k depending where you can find one. as far as i know there isnt a 318 one (although if it is an m40 one you could adapt an m20 one)

what sort of 318 is yours? facelift or pre facelift?

you are in Oz? pre facelift manual boxes sell for bugger all here...a couple of hundred $ or so

not sure how serious you are about getting more power, but best bet is to prob get a standard box - as long as looked after they seem to handle decent power.

if its an m10, an m30 or s14 box will fit

if its an m40, an m50 box will fit...a m20 box can be made to fit but needs work.

all those boxes should be enough for a decent amount of power

[Mike 1]

^ agreed

CV's will give you grief before any of those boxes

[CamB 48]

you are talking about 2 different boxes

refer to Kerry's post above...a dogleg gearbox (for m20 or s14) is around 2-3k depending where you can find one. as far as i know there isnt a 318 one (although if it is an m40 one you could adapt an m20 one)

Also there is an even more expensive dogleg box from the 2002's which would fit (it's weak too).

here in AUS i was told that they were going for neally 10 thousand, there unbreakable i want a gearbox that can withstand alot of power since i am aiming to get big power from my car. Are there any other gearboxes that are just as good and not soo expensive??

How much power are you talking? For what purpose (drag? street?). How will you get the power? 300hp from a turbo M10 is not out of the question (neither is 500hp, but that will cost $$$$$$$$).

I'd put a Toyota supra w58 box on if it was me and I was serious. They take 300hp easy. Conversion kit readily available, with high power clutch options, from:

http://www.conversioncomp.co.nz/ in NZ (note a BMW 2002 is a '70s BMW with an M10 engine), or possibly

http://www.dellowauto.com.au/ in Australia (they don't list one for BMWs).

[beema 0]

My aim is to get round 400hp from the car. but anything under ill still be happy with.

[JiB 0]

My aim is to get round 400hp from the car. but anything under ill still be happy with.

CamB is right, a W series toyota box is bulletproof and cost effective. Fits in the E30 drive tunnel too. Probably need a W55/W58 with remote shifter for easiest fitment. Remember to factor costs of custom bellhousing and driveshaft. /toyota geek

But if you're made of money you can get PPG in to make up some straight gears and dog collars. This would probably yield the best results for competition use. They are based in South Australia iirc. And I'm guessing it'd be cheaper than big branded Quaife or equivalent.

[greenday-rulz21 4]

an up-over-up layout, from first gear to second. Thats where it gets its name from because it resembles a hind leg of a dog!

"an up-over-up shift between first and second gear resembling the hind leg of a dog"

-Wikipedia

not bad

[Mike 1]

CamB is right, a W series toyota box is bulletproof and cost effective. Fits in the E30 drive tunnel too. Probably need a W55/W58 with remote shifter for easiest fitment. Remember to factor costs of custom bellhousing and driveshaft. /toyota geek

But if you're made of money you can get PPG in to make up some straight gears and dog collars. This would probably yield the best results for competition use. They are based in South Australia iirc. And I'm guessing it'd be cheaper than big branded Quaife or equivalent.

be cheaper to run an M30 box. I haven't done it but apparently only needs a BFH for clearance in the tunnel.

how you planning on getting 400hp? is it from the M10?

[2002 1]

Another option.

I've just about finished my M10 to Ford Type 9 (Sierra) conversion in my 2002. So far it's looking good, hopefully I'll pick up my driveshaft tomorrow.

If you want to know why I've gone for a Type 9, check out Quaffe's website for the goodies that are available for the type 9.

Edited May 29, 2008 by 2002

[kerrynzl 3]

CamB is right, a W series toyota box is bulletproof and cost effective. Fits in the E30 drive tunnel too. Probably need a W55/W58 with remote shifter for easiest fitment. Remember to factor costs of custom bellhousing and driveshaft. /toyota geek

But if you're made of money you can get PPG in to make up some straight gears and dog collars. This would probably yield the best results for competition use. They are based in South Australia iirc. And I'm guessing it'd be cheaper than big branded Quaife or equivalent.

Good advice, Chuck a Straight-cut gearset in . Simon Pfitzner [ PPG] supplies all the NZV8 boxes.

It'll be fun. A dog-shift box clunks around a bit if you are trying to cruise with a "hunting" cam [ they are designed for wide open throttle or hard decelaration ]

For the street buy a brand new Tremec TKO,

on Lexus V8 conversions they use a machined adapter plate that bolts into an Auto Bellhousing [ can anyone confirm whether a BMW bellhousing unbolts from an Auto trans ]

[Silver Fox 43]

None of the E30 boxes that I'm aware of unbolt.

[beema 0]

be cheaper to run an M30 box. I haven't done it but apparently only needs a BFH for clearance in the tunnel.

how you planning on getting 400hp? is it from the M10?

Ive got an m3 engine that im planning on using!

[beema 0]

im new wth the whole bmw thing so i wouldnt know. Is the m10, a type of engine that comes in the e30's? i had mums car saw vids of them and just wanted to start working on it but yer i baught an m3 engine so hopefully im heading in the right direction!

[Silver Fox 43]

Yeah, the M10 is the early 316/318 engine, up to 88 model in E30's.

[CamB 48]

be cheaper to run an M30 box. I haven't done it but apparently only needs a BFH for clearance in the tunnel.

how you planning on getting 400hp? is it from the M10?

I'm not planning on it. I haven't given up thoughts of turboing mine, but would should for 200-250hp from 2 litres.

You're right, it probably would be cheaper. I'd still go the Toyota because its comparatively easier/cheaper to get gears cut for it (because its well known).

_Dan - IF the gearbox is from the S14 M3 engine, it is already pretty strong. There are stronger ones which have been suggested. BMW engines discussed here which are relevant to you:

M10 - the early 4 cylinder engine from late '60s to 1985(?) - various sizes from 1.6 to 2.0 litres. A pre-facelift 318i E30 has the 1.8 litre version.

S14 - came only in the E30 M3 - basically an M10 block (not quite, but close) with a 4 valve per cylinder head.

M30 - early 6 cylinder engine - same age as the M10, and basically an M10 with 2 extra cylinders

S50 something - the M5/M6 engine, which is pretty much a 4 valve per cylinder M30.

The S14 gearbox is a dogleg Getrag 265. I think the M30s also had 265s, but don't know if all 265s are equally strong. If boxes from more powerful engines are stronger, I'd guess the M5 box is strongest.

Given the stupendous amount of money you will need to spend to get the HP you want out of an M3 engine, on top of the already high cost of the engine and the required rebuild to handle boost, can I suggest either:

- finding someone local who is a guru - you'll need them at every step of the way; or

- going with a Toyota or Nissan turbo 4 or 6, coz it'll be cheaper.

[Mike 1]

Ive got an m3 engine that im planning on using!

might want to give us some more info next time dude,

what M3 motor is it? S14, S50, or S54? they all use different boxes, so if its a later model S5x type then what we've told you is a waste of time. and none of those M3 motors make 400hp, or will get there with the standard bolt on mods. what have you got planned for it?