S50B32 Grinding noise...

[*Glenn* 854]

Looks like I might have been right... maybe... the only reason for the damage on the front exhaust journal & camshaft bearing surfaces would be too much loading by the chain tensioner not being set correctly, assembly issues or oil supply issues.

Dane... the camshaft bearing tray needs to be line bored to suit the camshaft journals which is probably going to cost more than buying second hand parts

[Danger 31]

Right about what? Its lack of oil whether that be a blockage or what im not sure but i've blown the oil passage clear now anyway. Usually i pull the plugs and run the oil pressure up off the starter for a motor i care about that ive changed oil on but its a bit of a mission on the s50.

I'm not convinced it needs line boring to be honest but i'm pricing it all up. Untill i locate suitable replacement parts thats the route i'll be taking.

[*Glenn* 854]

I wish you all the best with your repair endeavours 

[Danger 31]

Cam carriers out and cleaned up. Looks like the no1 intake cam journal was starting to score also. Would indicate that the oil pressure wasn't reaching the front of the carrier passages. Whether that could possibly be due to being too thin or just not enough pressure i'm unsure.

[Danger 31]

I understand the difference between pressure and flow but for the purposes I was describing they are relative and only the pressure can be easily measured.

I may well be misguided but my thoughts are that under the same flow rates, a lower viscosity oil would be more inclined to take the path of least resistance away from an area under a focused load such as the bottom of a front cam journal, thus providing less of a barrier than a thicker oil?

Is there a specific method for changing oil in a S50B32? Couldn't have gotten an air lock somewhere? I guess if the pump goes through the filter and fills the oiler cooler system first before getting to the head then that could be a possible reason as to why?

 

[Danger 31]

Its been a long time since I did anything with fluid dynamics.

What oil would you recommend?

Edited October 18, 2016 by Danger

[M3AN 4016]

I think this is being enormously over complicated. Even the cheapest mineral oil available off the shelf would be good enough to lubricate those parts assuming it got there.

Or I may have missed some sarcasm above? 

[M3AN 4016]

Okay, it's well known I don't agree with everything Ron says but to recommend a semi-synthetic oil for the S50 is beyond barmy! I'm stunned.

Do NOT use that Magnatec oil Dane, use fully synthetic oil (Edge is Castrol's brand for this in NZ and elsewhere).

I'm not going to debate that in this thread either, read the rest of the internet to work out why a mineral based oil is stupid.

http://www.castrol.com/en_nz/new-zealand/car-engine-oil/engine-oil-types.html

Any reputable synthetic oil from 0w-30 to 10w-60 will work just fine in these engines, something somewhere in between those extremes would be preferable.

Edit: I've used Edge 10w-60 and 5w-40 and prefer the 5w-40 which is what I use currently.

Edited October 18, 2016 by M3AN

[Danger 31]

Yeah im just gonna go ahead and fix my head then look into the oil thing

[KwS 2425]

To my knowledge the only magnatec available in NZ is semi-synth, no fully synthetic. This is backed up by the Castrol NZ site not listing an full synthetic version. http://www.castrol.com/en_nz/new-zealand/car-engine-oil/engine-oil-brands/castrol-magnatec-brand/magnatec-product-page.html

My S50B30 loved Valvoline Synpower 5W-40. Much happier on that than the Motul that was in it when i got it.

[M3AN 4016]

s.m.h. 

[KwS 2425]

So, to sum it all up, the best oil to use is an oil that isnt available here.

[hybrid 1043]

Anyways .... 

It is possible you may have a clogged journal  somewhere however if the pressure lock valve has stopped functioning which is the valve used to hold oil pressure in the head oil journals. These leak and the n.
A tail tail sign is first start you will hear a strong ticking sound of the lifters until oil flows to the head
I would also look to pop the sump off and inspect the  oil pump and pick ups as well.

                                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    

[Danger 31]

Any idea where i find said valve? 

[KwS 2425]

Is that the constant pressure valve? If it is, it resides under the exhaust manifold towards the rear of the block, on the side.

[Danger 31]

Thanks, will inspect

[KwS 2425]

Real prone to leaking oil, but not sure if they are that common to actually fail. Worth a look though.

[*Glenn* 854]

I cannot believe how this thread has progressed from changing an oil filter & engine oil  > to a noise > not diagnosed properly > to engine damage that would not have been caused by Danes oil choice. The engine has now been dismantled to a point where it is now no longer able to have the fault diagnosed correctly . I feel sorry for Danes position and I really feel he's been lead down a path that was unnecessary on this forum . He could of used SAE30 and it would not have caused damage in a short period of time and quite a few of the race guys are using 10w40 Full Zinc in the M3 Race engines . 

[M3AN 4016]

I don't actually think he's done anything as a direct result of this thread Glenn so I fear you've reached the wrong conclusion on that part. I suspect it's because he's smarter enough to realise, well, internet.

I do however agree that much of the advice in this thread is irrelevant to his problem. Although to your last point, I said the same thing earlier on.

On 10/18/2016 at 3:58 PM, M3AN said:

...Even the cheapest mineral oil available off the shelf would be good enough to lubricate those parts assuming it got there.

 

[*Glenn* 854]

1 minute ago, M3AN said:

I don't actually think he's done anything as a direct result of this thread .

 

Yes he has...he's not diagnosed the problem first before dismantling components as I suggested. 90% of a repair is diagnosing the actual fault first

[*Glenn* 854]

I feel that a lot of previous posts have caused Dane to make poor decisions because he felt it was coming from professionals that are responsible (legally) and have the knowledge to give the right advice.

[M3AN 4016]

Now you're drawing a really long bow Glenn.

I just reread the thread because my perception was different to yours and it remains different. Dane hasn't followed any amateur advice in this thread, everything he's done he was doing anyway. All the amateurs have done is speculate on oil types and grades, Dane was going to overhaul the VANOS irrespective of this thread. Nor has he jumped aboard with your advice as if it were gospel and I have no opinion on that either way.

I'm not convinced you can diagnose a grinding noise without visually inspecting, which is what he did and in doing so he found what's making the noise. So all up, that was effort well spent. What caused the wear remains a matter for speculation and I suspect that is where your expertise can best contribute.

I think you're doing Dane a disservice by assuming he was blindly following the advice of amateurs, he did post this very early on.

On 14/09/2016 at 7:08 PM, Danger said:

The way I see it, i'm delving into what appears to logically be the problem area while completing some preventative maintenance along the way.

I've shown the car to 2 mechanics for their opinions on the noise and spent hours reading threads detailing various s50b32 issues.

I've then posted this thread seeking additional advice.

With all due respect i've worked on plenty of engines before and i'm hardly "blindly pulling things apart"

I see a connection to a recent thread of yours Glenn about your disillusionment with this site but I really don't see this thread as an example (as much of a train wreck it has become). Don't be disheartened Glenn, your opinions still shine through the mess of amateur conjecture that will always make up the bulk of any open internet forum. And many of us notice your professional opinions.

 

 

[Danger 31]

I'm not even sure how to respond to this..

Excuse my ignorance but i see no way to have diagnosed the issue with confidence without disassembly or further running time to exacerbate the damage so i'm happy with what i've done to date.

I actually enjoy working on my cars and becoming familiar with their engines first hand so yes, this may have not been the most efficient way to diagnose the issue however i'm not paying myself by the hour and i now know a hell of a lot more about the engine than i did beforehand.

As always, i take any internet advice with a grain of salt however i appreciate any input given from you lot.

[Funkyflynz 151]

Interesting thread. Any chance of an update 7 years later?  Lol