Shocks and Springs VS. Coilovers

[APT 179]

Hey guys im looking for opinions on shocks/springs vs coilovers, my car is going to be mainly used for road/weekend driving, but i would also like to take it out on the track some days.

Is there a big benefit apart from height adjustment? - If i were to go shocks/springs i would be using Koni damper adj. shocks

[CamB 48]

Hey guys im looking for opinions on shocks/springs vs coilovers, my car is going to be mainly used for road/weekend driving, but i would also like to take it out on the track some days.

Is there a big benefit apart from height adjustment? - If i were to go shocks/springs i would be using Koni damper adj. shocks

My 2c - not really a **big** advantage. Mostly the advantage with coilovers is that you can:

- coilovers are narrow - you can use them with adjustable strut top mounts to get more camber

- you can shorten the struts (and use shorter shocks - eg the Ground Control kit) and have the car much lower but still in the shocks good working range

- you can corner weight the car

- a wide variety (and easy to replace) springs

These are advantages ... but the E30 series guys manage to be pretty damn quick using regular springs and shocks. Maybe they can chime in with what they'd like to do differently (I understand more camber?).

[Jeddy 0]

I have the Koni adj shocks and H&R springs and have found them fantastic. The quality of both is great. I also use the GC rear shock mounts which have the ability to be adjusted in terms of stiffness. They also have a life-time guarantee for peace of mind.

I haven't had the chance to take the car on the track so the shocks have spent most of there time on the softest setting. However if I was to head to the track, I can see the adjustability being very useful.

I considered getting coil-overs but the hassle of having to get a Cert put me off.

What sort of coil-overs would you be using?

[APT 179]

I would be using BC Gold Set up, I have to get a cert anyway due to the new engine and spacers im running. Cheers for the advise guys

[diablo23 1]

yeah i'd go with coilovers anyday over lowering springs

[CamB 48]

Just to clarify - it sounds cool to be able to lower and raise your car all the time (eg up to get warrants, down to get chicks).

However, if you really need an alignment each time unless the change is small.

[westy 614]

Is there a big benefit apart from height adjustment?

No, not for a road warrior/occasional track slag.

If the choice is between Koni std type and BC coilovers....

If the E30 class suspension can live on the street(not too firm) then just use that.

2c of f**k all

[pjay 8]

Coilovers have the wank wank factor. I've never seen benefit in damper adjustable shocks on a road faring car though hence my coilovers are only height adjustable.

Coilovers have a decent resale value also because they are "oooh coilovers, wank wank"

You can call adjustable coilovers justies while adjusting the flat peak of your cap.

Coilovers go really low, which is pretty pointless bar aesthetics on a NZ road faring car.

Get justies, get low, join the club.

[Jacko 2078]

I got some coilover questions to throw into the mix -

Adjustable konis and H&R springs = $2000+

BC Gold/XYZ coilovers = Less than $1300 NZ+welding etc so maybe $1500.

The H&R and konis you are limited to rebound adjustment.

XYZ/BC gold's have height, front camber plates, and rebound adjustment + you can specify spring rates.

I have a mate who builds drift cars, half of them run BC golds, and according to him they have some muppet drivers who smash them over curbing etc sideways, and he has never seen any failure from a BC gold.

Is there any ACTUAL quality difference between the two setups, not "thats chinese/taiwanese rubbish" quality perceptions, but has anyone actually run both setups? Be interested in hearing your thoughts.

I had adjustable konis before and know the deal with them, yup they are good, but are they that much better to justify the 25%+ higher price? The current suspension in my E30 cost $800 for springs and shocks (german supersport cup kit), and on a cost Vs. Grin factor it is far superior to the 944's koni's.

Im in the same bucket as APT, and im sure many others. My car is a daily driver, but id like to take it too the track and have some fun, which is where the adjustment of the coilovers appeals. Can run it sedate every day but wind it all up hard as nails on a track day+play with camber etc just to see what happens!

Also the ability to get the ride height/stance *just* right appeals, Too many times ive bought lowering springs and gone, "damnit I wish it was 10mm lower at the front". Dont wanna slamming and rimming, just have it sitting right!

Does anyone here actually use BC golds/XYZ/Ground controls? Seems everyone has jumped on the H&R+koni bandwagon which kinda skews the opinions

On another note -

Whats the deal with e30 rear coilovers in the stock position not being "real" coil overs? I realise the spring and shock are in different positions, but whats the downside too this? Ive seen big threads online about people converting the rear end of an e30 into a true coilover setup, and having to reinforce the stock strut towers to take the loads of the spring as well. I dont see the point, am I missing something?

Edited October 8, 2010 by Jacko

[HaNs 226]

Will do E30 Vmaxx this month only for $1000

[CamB 48]

I have no experience with those coilovers, so won't offer an opinion

On another note -

Whats the deal with e30 rear coilovers in the stock position not being "real" coil overs? I realise the spring and shock are in different positions, but whats the downside too this? Ive seen big threads online about people converting the rear end of an e30 into a true coilover setup, and having to reinforce the stock strut towers to take the loads of the spring as well. I dont see the point, am I missing something?

Its to do with being low, having a high enough spring rate for your goal AND avoiding coil bind (and, for New Zealand, having captive springs). Let me know if that's not clear and I'll do a better job explaining.

[westy 614]

On another note -

Whats the deal with e30 rear coilovers in the stock position not being "real" coil overs? I realise the spring and shock are in different positions, but whats the downside too this? Ive seen big threads online about people converting the rear end of an e30 into a true coilover setup, and having to reinforce the stock strut towers to take the loads of the spring as well. I dont see the point, am I missing something?

And a spring that has a closer relationship to the wheel is better able to control the actions of said wheel.

Pretty flash eh?

[thorburn 120]

And a spring that has a closer relationship to the wheel is better able to control the actions of said wheel.

Pretty flash eh?

Are you saying a lower offset wheel will cause you to have less control?

Nope I think this is to flash for me. Can you explain the relationship?

Is there any figures from a shock dyno on any of these shocks?

Are BC or XYZ's rebuildable? Without swapping to a different insert

Why not just buy some coilover sleeves from stocks or autolign and make your own?

[CamB 48]

The last option is surprisingly expensive. Their camber plates aren't cheap.

[polley 916]

I have bilstein / h&r. I find the h&r's to be rather soft, probally not much stiffer than stock.

[bmpower 3]

This is probably aimed more at the tracking your car side of things - its not just about coilovers or springs/shocks - you need to also look into bushes of all types, sway bars, camber plates, shock mounts, lsd, strut braces, etc etc etc.

I have H&R Springs and Koni Adjustables. My car handles very well on the track and a few people on here have seen that first hand. However i have done the other things as mentioned above. I personally don't see much of an advantage of going to coilovers etc especially with the whole cert thing etc.

Sticking with the spring / shock option is a much easier option.

Thats just my 2c, i'm not an expert on the subject by any means.

Edited October 8, 2010 by bmpower

[APT 179]

Wow! Thanks for all the comments guys, I already have to get a cert for my car so adjustables arent too big a deal. ^^bmpower I have done most/all things- (apart from sway bars) to my car so im not cutting out the koni/H&R option. Have been to a few Welders Re. Coilovers and they all seem to be able to do it but at a price $$$.

Cheers Andrew

[bmpower 3]

I guess where i'm coming from is that my car spends alot of time on the track and will be spending alot more time there next year and i've had no issues at all with the koni / h&r way and personally wont be changing to coilovers anytime soon. So my opinion is just saying how good i think the spring shock combo has been for me.

[Jacko 2078]

By shock mounts I assume you mean the meyle HD ones for the rear? Or are there others?

[bmpower 3]

Aftermarket shock mounts, ie. AKG, Ireland Engineering etc, anything that support the rear shock tower and top of the shock a bit more.

Edit: Or Z3 style ones etc

Edited October 8, 2010 by bmpower

[Jacko 2078]

Anyone seen/know of Koni coil overs? The Koni website is all show and no go, cant find anything listed for an E30, but I have reason to believe they exist

[flake 0]

http://www.ground-control-store.com/produc...gory.php/CA=173

[Jacko 2078]

Yup seen thoses, theres a quite a few that use koni shocks, but these are actually made by entirely by koni.

[Forrest 35]

Jacko PM Paul, bimmersport user (#14)

I am sure he can get them in/indulge you on pricing etc.

[Jacko 2078]

Chur