Looking for an answer

[swordfish 30]

Hello everybody

I am looking for genuine BMW, BBS, Schnitzer or any similar wheels for E36 M3 with offset between Et28 and ET18 on both front and rear. Are there any in BMW range with this offset?

Thank you for help

[E30-323ti 66]

OE E46 M3 rear wheels are 18x9" et28 IIRC

OE E34 M5 wheels are 17x8" et20 and rare rears are 17x9" et22 (with T-star or Turbine covers)

OE E39 M-sport are 17x8" et20 and 17x9" et26 nb. 74mm centre-bore, will need hub rings

Jump on realoem.com and just trawl through the BMW model range, lots of wheels there!!

[BM WORLD 1283]

e38 16" bbs et23 8" wide

[E30-323ti 66]

A good source to trawl: BMW OE Wheels

[swordfish 30]

Thank you guys!!!

[kiwi535 538]

all e34 5 series wheels are around 20 m offset( as are e23 e24,e32 and prolly e28)

[swordfish 30]

Why,

E36 M3 offset is ET 38 to 41 depending on wheels fitted

Not if you install a propper set of coilovers on it (Koni adjustables) it is not. The problem with M3 wheels they are too far inside. If you want to lower your car or put good coilovers in you need spacers, or in my opinion new set of wheels to fit the set up. which I am currently strugling to find I am going for E34 wheels as their offset is perfect and they are wide enough to fit good sticky tire on it (Goodyear F1's )

[swordfish 30]

Doesn't sound correct.

Koni Sport adjustables retain exactly the same geometry as the original strut.

Koni Coil overs have exactly the same mount set up as the Sport adjustables so where does the shift come from?

I have lowered M3 sport adjustables and OE M3 evolution wheels on mine and geometry is perfect

Those are FKs coilovers with KONI adjustable stuts and stainless steal bodies. I think their springs touch the inside of the wheel when installed.

[thorburn 121]

I have lowered M3 sport adjustables and OE M3 evolution wheels on mine and geometry is perfect

This is an opinion

I am going for E34 wheels as their offset is perfect (another opinion)and they are wide enough to fit good sticky tire on it (Goodyear F1's )

You'll need to do some gaurd work to put on big boy tyres(225's are a tight fit)

I'd use spacers

[nastnas 9]

You're more than welcome to purchase my BBS RS 212s....

[CamB 48]

I think their springs touch the inside of the wheel when installed.

Think or know? Have you tried yet? It might be ok...

(edit) google showed me the potential problem... not ideal:

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showp...mp;postcount=49

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showp...mp;postcount=55

Edited December 22, 2011 by CamB

[CamB 48]

Ron - have another look at my post I added some links with the problem (the spring perch winds down into the way of the tyre).

Spacers and increased offset are only a semi-evil. Porsche offers them. If you try too much on an E36 you start losing tyre (or rubbing guards), as well as modestly affect handling.

Edited December 22, 2011 by CamB

[swordfish 30]

You're more than welcome to purchase my BBS RS 212s....

Pics please!

[swordfish 30]

Ok the answer to your question is "I think" in relation to my car. I haven't tried to put the coilovers on my car YET! But "I know" it is not going to fit as I have done tones of research on these coilovers and the guy from the company, who sold me those told me that I will need at least 5 mm spacers on the front and 10mm on the rear, but he didn't take into account that I have 18" 9J wheels at the back with ET41 offset and 8J with ET38 in the front. So my idea was to find good staggered set of E34 wheels and slam them on (preferably 17s). I have adjustable rear control arms from Turner Motorsport to get everything properly in balance and will be using Evo strut tops in reverse order to get more negative camber as my M3 is pre Evo (pre-Evo version has less negative camber due to its undeveloped front suspension geometry). I hope this will clarify the picture for you guys. I really appreciate your input into this!

[westy 614]

Please bear in mind that BMW perfected the art of front end suspension design with the E36, and that any deviation from BMWs master plan will result in the unbalance of the universe causing irreversible damage to the fabric of space and time.

Wont someone think of the children!

[m325i 709]

BMWs master plan

LOL

Happy Hannukah

[Neal 544]

I reckon the M3 E46 18x9 rears would look great on the back

I know of a set of rears that will be coming up around Feb when I swap them out of new ones

They have some kurb rash that needs sorting, but run true.

Also have a 16x8 ACS type 1 rim that needs re-furb.

[swordfish 30]

I reckon the M3 E46 18x9 rears would look great on the back

I know of a set of rears that will be coming up around Feb when I swap them out of new ones

They have some kurb rash that needs sorting, but run true.

Also have a 16x8 ACS type 1 rim that needs re-furb.

I have a chance to get E46 M3 wheels, the rear wheels are going to fit fine, but fronts are ET41 I think, so not so good, but I might get spacers for the front

[Neal 544]

I have a chance to get E46 M3 wheels, the rear wheels are going to fit fine, but fronts are ET41 I think, so not so good, but I might get spacers for the front

Have seen the fronts in a 8 1/2 as reps. There was a pair on TM for serval months. Something else to consider.

The 17's sound like a good way to go as well.

[nastnas 9]

[swordfish 30]

Why would you want to sell these??? They look awesome!!! Probably way out of my price range though

[CamB 48]

He is looking for more camber so the tyre doesn't foul the arch when used with lower offset wheels or spacers, which he needs to use because the design of the coilovers puts the perch level with the tyre when at the desired ride height.

So, I am pretty sure shimming the bottom (you said top?) king pin mounts will move the wheel closer to the problem area on the strut, so even lower offset would be needed and negate any tyre clearance due to increased camber gained from the mod.

The real solution is to see if there is a spring combination that works with a higher perch position, so the wheels don't need to be changed. His desire for camber is second order to offset.

In other news, in the "good old days" they didn't worry so much - the 2002 turbo had wider track to fill the arches through wider, lower offset wheels.

Edited December 23, 2011 by CamB

[swordfish 30]

He is looking for more camber so the tyre doesn't foul the arch when used with lower offset wheels or spacers, which he needs to use because the design of the coilovers puts the perch level with the tyre when at the desired ride height.

So, I am pretty sure shimming the bottom (you said top?) king pin mounts will move the wheel closer to the problem area on the strut, so even lower offset would be needed and negate any tyre clearance due to increased camber gained from the mod.

The real solution is to see if there is a spring combination that works with a higher perch position, so the wheels don't need to be changed. His desire for camber is second order to offset.

In other news, in the "good old days" they didn't worry so much - the 2002 turbo had wider track to fill the arches through wider, lower offset wheels.

This is exactly what my plan and the purpose of this is... The wheels I am looking for are no more than 15-20mm different in offset, which with new set up will not give me too much problem as they will remain under arches. I will also keep all the stock setting using adjustments on the arms and the coilovers. I am changing the hats as I have read it is the best mode to get a perfect set up on the early E36 M3s, surely it will increase uneven tyre wear, but it is supposed to make it more stable in corners due to greater traction from the front wheels.

[swordfish 30]

So you have a bunch of parts you know wont fit in and your solution is to fudge it by using wheels with a different offset rather than fudging it using spacers.

You are then going to reverse the top hats so you have a huge amount of negative camber , why do you want this?

The Early M3 is actually well developed and runs more negative camber than the EVO , reason it has less caster so it needs more static camber.

I listed my camber settings and these work very well with the early caster setting.

What you could try with your current wheels is:

Flipping the top hats and then shimming the two top hub mounts (this is how I change my camber)

You might need some spacers to fit over the bolts to get enough adjustment.

You should only be looking for about 6 to 10 mm at the top of the tyre

The benefits of this set up rather than what you are contemplating are:

- The more inclined strut angle put the suspension axis further out

- The original wheel geometry will probably line up with the steering axis

- This will result in geometry that works well

The options of either spacing or changing wheel off set will mis-align the suspension axis and the contact patch of the tyre, this has been covered many times , the compromises are:

- Unstable under brakes

- Tram lining

- Wandering at speed

- Rubbish low speed handling

- Rubbish High speed handling

- Rubbish steering feedback

- Loading up of steering in high speed corners

- Unstable at high speed in corners

In short fudging it either way is not going to get a good result- look at way to get close to the original geometry and allow some adjustment to match what you want to do with the car.

I am sure most of M3 owners will be wondering why am I changing anything at all, right? Just put stock struts in and new springs and I would be fine. I bought the parts with a certain purpose, to make my car to handle better, although most of you would think that it wouldn't work and it would be even worse. But I would like to believe that as soon as I get this set up to work properly it will be great. The coilovers were getting great reviews on American websites, they are designed on the Nurberg Ring and made in Germany. The have read a lot about the rest of the mods as well and they will be done for a number of reasons; some of those you have already discussed here.

Edited December 23, 2011 by swordfish

[swordfish 30]

M3 's definitely benefit from better shocks so that part of what you are doing makes sense.

Increasing the displacement between the axis of the front suspension and the contact patch of the tyre by changing the off set will be detrimental and 15mm is a LOT.

Cam, read my comments again, I did say the top hub mountings and that is what I meant.

If the strut is inclined more inward at the top then this will create room between the strut and the guard.

By shimming out the two top bolts this will space the wheel away from the strut (instead of the wheel being parallel to the strut it will now angle slightly outward at the top) so it shouldnt foul the spring.

Because the space between the strut and the guard has been increased and he is retaining the original offset he should not run into the issue of fouling the guards and the front geometry should be close to original or a slight variation there of.

I would seriously suggest you look at this because it could give a much better result and you can do it with all the bits you have.

P.S. I always treat "rave reviews and particularly american rave reviews" with a LOT of skepticism. I look at the physics and work out what is actually going on

So do I, that is why I am trying to read posts from different countries including russia and scandinavia (thats where I am from) I will look into doing what you have described above, hopefully it will all end up to be a win win situation for me. I appreciate your help!