kiwi328i 118 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 wow i didnt know thats what the M62 is like, thats a very obvious design flaw! is it possible to retrofit the M60 system? Yes apparently. Check out those fullahs doing the M60B44 conversions. 4.4 bottom end, 4.0 heads, intake etc OB1, and full frontal, some gaskets and silicone and bam. Most of the benefits of the larger capacity and the more reliable M60 timing gear, and being OB1, able to mate up to the older Bmws. Conspiracy blokes reckon they got cheap with the M62, maybe? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aja540i 1906 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 If it works perfectly for 10+ years and 100xxx km, and then requires some maintainance, is it really a flawed design? How long was the warranty on a brand new e39? BMW is a business and has to make money like any other business, at least they still support their older models unlike most japanese and some other euro brands. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 Doing the timing gear every 150,000 or 200,000k does not seem like a big deal to me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael. 2313 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 Is it specified as a routine maintenance repair in the BMW workshop manuals? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 Is it specified as a routine maintenance repair in the BMW workshop manuals? Probably specified that it lasts the life of the engine lol. That always makes me laugh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael. 2313 Report post Posted March 17, 2015 Yeah that lies the problem, a lot of people think oh it's chain driven, no need to replace it like a cambelt! So such maintenance is overlooked until many owners and years later, one of them has to face the slowly developing guide issues. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BreakMyWindow 1874 Report post Posted March 19, 2015 Yeah I blame used car salesman planting a seed in peoples heads, that timing chains are maintenance free - Certainly the implication. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael. 2313 Report post Posted March 19, 2015 Ironic that water pumps and such related parts would have been serviced yet all those timing bits would have been left, even though it would have been a perfect time to replace such parts if specified in the service manual at proper intervals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KwS 2425 Report post Posted March 19, 2015 dont even get me started on dealers changing cambelts as cheap as possible and not doing waterpump and tensioners.... :| 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
coop 261 Report post Posted March 21, 2015 If it works perfectly for 10+ years and 100xxx km, and then requires some maintainance, is it really a flawed design? How long was the warranty on a brand new e39? BMW is a business and has to make money like any other business, at least they still support their older models unlike most japanese and some other euro brands. Yes, end of the day, nothing mechanical is service free (think ZF 'sealed for life' - a crock). But it seems some motors aren't as strong in the valvetrain as others - Falcon sohc and dohc 4.0 straight sixs will do over 1 million km without been opened up on original chain tensioner guides. I've also seen Commodore 3.8 V6 and 5.7 V8 pushrod over 500,000k unopened too. Then you get the early 2000s dohc Falcon V8s that had weak tensioners and would eventually wear out the guides causing chain rattle, within 100,000km. Personally I'd go for timing gears, the old Honda CBR250s will do over 100,000km no worries, while the ZXR/FZR timing chains will start to rattle around 30,000km. At work we can get 2 or 3 rebuilds to a 15 litre Cummins engine block, rebuild every 800,000km , and never had to replace a timing gear - 1.6m-2.4m km on original set of gears try doing that with a chain! As for the M62 issue, I've seen a few listed on TM saying the chain/tensioners/guides have been done, but didn't realise it was a common issue, a good excuse to go an E34 I reckon. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dn540 67 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Your're on point there coop, a friend of dads is on his second set of chain tensioners in his 5.4 BA in only a few thousands k's. Tensioner piston seal buggered itself and takes too long to build up pressure. Got the car home today, definitely making some rattling chain noises! Just out of interested, what would the car be worth roughly to sell it on how it currently sits? 240k, new tyres on the style 66's, new plugs, oil, cabin filters etc. Don't really want to fix it as need the money to tune my Ford but at the same time it seems such a waste to flick it off. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kingkarl 136 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Personally I'd go for timing gears, the old Honda CBR250s will do over 100,000km no worries, while the ZXR/FZR timing chains will start to rattle around 30,000km. Im in the market for a lams bike so found this very interesting. Too bad those old jap bikes are so flogged in other areas (forks, bearings, electrics etc). Seems like the engines can take it at least. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Forks and bearings are easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
coop 261 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Im in the market for a lams bike so found this very interesting. Too bad those old jap bikes are so flogged in other areas (forks, bearings, electrics etc). Seems like the engines can take it at least. Try and find a good example, or, a cheap one and spend some money on it. Learn to ride it fast and you wont regret. I think I could do the coro loop or rimutakas quicker on my old CBR250 than a thou. Awesome bikes those. Dont f**k around with those modern sh*t sounding 250 twins Hyofag/Ninja etc. Are the 400s lams approved... CBR/RVF/VFR? Dn540, yeah the Falcon ones affected the 2002-2005 models and I think most were done under warranty. From memory the tensioners were plastic and warped, allowing oil to leak out. Revised ones are steel, I think most on the road would have been done by now. The parts can be had cheap from OZ or USA. How could I forget, my old Mercedes needed the chain and tensioners done too. sohc V8, M116/117 from the 70s/80s. Only good for 160,000km according to forums, not a lot of change out of $1500. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Rvf400 is lams. Good luck finding one. Vfr400 isn't, though I've mostly got away riding one for a few years now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kingkarl 136 Report post Posted April 7, 2015 Try and find a good example, or, a cheap one and spend some money on it. Learn to ride it fast and you wont regret. I think I could do the coro loop or rimutakas quicker on my old CBR250 than a thou. Awesome bikes those. Dont f**k around with those modern sh*t sounding 250 twins Hyofag/Ninja etc. Are the 400s lams approved... CBR/RVF/VFR? That was my thinking too. I rode a 250 bandit (4cyl, 16k RPM, 45hp etc) on the weekend. To be honest I didn't enjoy the lack of torque at all. I've ridden mainly singles in the past so have a different reference point for low RPM handling. Even my 150cc 2 stroke felt torquey relative to the bandit! I have since started looking at the twins (Ducati, Honda VFR etc). Sure they dont sound as good but for city traffic the ease of torque is very attractive. Or maybe I just need to get used to the idea of revving the crap out of whatever I do buy. If the maintenance wasnt so onerous i'd go a KTM 525exc motard with a loud exhaust. mmmmm Would never buy a ninja/hyoshit or cbr300! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
