wrs 120 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 Thanks - good points!! The pedal has 20mm of movement before it starts to load up. This photo shows the slave cylinder: It's a view looking up from under the car. The bleed valve points downwards off the bottom of the cylinder - how can trapped air bleed out of the cylinder with this configuration? I guess the slave cylinder has to be removed and bled with the valve pointing up? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thorburn 121 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 crappy vid butt its easier then me describing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 Now that's a good way to do it. Thanks for the help. I'll give this a go tomorrow night after sourcing some bits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
will 169 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 With the bleed nipple in that position, you will struggle to get the air out. Reverse bleeding is one way to do it but it ideally needs the line in to be at the highest point so the air goes up it, otherwise you will still not free the air trapped inside. The other way is to remove the cylinder from the box, secure the piston so it cant pop out, then bleed it with the nipple facing up, this way you can be sure you will get rid of all the air. My way is to use a long bleed pipe from the nipple back to the reservoir, that way you dont have to worry about topping up, you simply keep pumping until you are absolutely sure the air is gone, then re-secure the cylinder on the box, nip up the bleed nipple and remove the bleed line first from the reservoir, then from the nipple. Have a bottle ready to catch the fluid draining from the pipe. If you leave the pipe in the reservoir when removing it from the bleed nipple, you will end up syphoning fluid from the reservoir. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 Awesome, thanks. Hadn't considered the fact the inlet also comes off the bottom of the cylinder... As I've never done this before I think I'll get a bit of help for the first time round - I don't want any mistakes when removing and refitting the slave. This is my daily driver and I need it to get to work in a rural location. I'm sure Garry will help - for a small fee. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 If the injectors were correctly modeled in the ecu, you shoudn't have any problems swapping in new injectors. Just change the master fuel and injector deadtime settings. If you go for well known injectors these settings will be easy to get/come with the injectors. Verify with a wideband after changing. You can change the some settings and use the vr sensor and/or the non vanos trigger settings. Very nice project, If it was tuned using VE that would work (which I think new link ECU's can do?), other wise if it was done with pulse width you'll need to adjust the entire fuel map. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polley 916 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 My way is to use a long bleed pipe from the nipple back to the reservoir, Never thought of that before but I like it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted October 7, 2015 If it was tuned using VE that would work (which I think new link ECU's can do?), other wise if it was done with pulse width you'll need to adjust the entire fuel map. Graham said it would have to be re-tuned so must be using PWM... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thorburn 121 Report post Posted October 8, 2015 If it was tuned using VE that would work (which I think new link ECU's can do?), other wise if it was done with pulse width you'll need to adjust the entire fuel map. I'm fairly confident it'll be tuned via VE Link has a base map for an m50 with all the preset settings on it. For example. If you've got a tuning cable, a wideband and a laptop i'd go for changing it yourself. I can add more if you choose to go down this path 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted October 8, 2015 Cheers, thanks, I have the PCLink software and used this to initially fault-find and get things going. I haven't reconnected since the tune was done. Will have a look see on the weekend. It's actually going ok as-is and 6-6.5k RPM is enough for now - at least until I get used to driving stick again. Changing injectors will only improve power above 6k which I seldom use anyway. Probably isn't worth the risk mucking with it for the small gain. I really only mentioned the injector mistake for anyone else considering this type of change to their engine. If they wanted more in the high-RPM area they would need the bigger injectors. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ahmedsinc 414 Report post Posted October 8, 2015 Wonder how it would go with an M54B30 intake and injectors? Would be simple enough to use an output on the Link to trigger the DISA valve to open between a set rev band and coolant temp / TPS reference, probably use the Vanos trigger points for convenience. More juice from the purple injectors coupled with the better flowing manifold.......... worth looking into anyway! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nobimmer 694 Report post Posted October 9, 2015 I used the pink m52 injectors and an adjustable regulator on my 3l and have no feeling issues, if anything it might be a touch rich. Makes pretty much the same power as yours with a similar torque curve however we aren't using vanos so it's interesting to see the comparison. I will try dig up the dyno sheet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted October 31, 2015 Today I replaced the trans fluid. It had some standard ATF fluid from the shop in it (it was red) and it was notchy and not nice to change most of the time - you never knew when it was going to bite back. Today I changed whatever it was in there to Amsoil MTF (5W30) full synthetic. So far it's excellent. Cold shifting is somewhat improved and while some mild notchiness is still there sometimes it's improved significantly. It's also a lot easier to get into 1st, 5th and reverse. The gearbox is much quieter too - no more mesh type sound. It's only done 100km on the new oil so far so the jury is still out - will see how it goes with 2000+k's on it. The Getrag S6S 420G appears to be very oil sensitive... I have a coupe of bottles of RP here too and may give it a try if the Amsoil ends up being a dog. Anyone tried Motul NISMO 2189E 75W140 (used by the GTR guys in the Nissan version of the 420g) - it's pretty expensive but supposed to be very good? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jibs05 86 Report post Posted October 31, 2015 wow 260hp at the flywheel and massive torque! wonder what it would be doing at the wheels/hubs? I need to take a lesson out of your book. Great work! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted November 1, 2015 Thanks. From what I can see as a difference between our setups is: M3 Cams No MAF Cold Air Intake M3 EVO Headers Link G4+ ECU with a Dyno Tune Not sure what exhaust you're running - I'm using a M3 Exhaust with CAT delete + AdrenalineR 2 in + 2 out resonator. To add M3 cams you'd have to add vanos or make a modified vanos to non-vanos adapter for the inlet cam. Everyhting else is pretty easy - although the M3 EVO Headers may not fit the E30... It's all possible - you can do it too!! (just need a nice fat wallet). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ahmedsinc 414 Report post Posted November 1, 2015 The difference will primarily be in the headers / exhaust and a proper tune (not just AFR at WOT). US S50 cams will bump the numbers a bit up top, cold air intake and MAF delete won't really change things appreciably. Adding Vanos tends to smooth out and slightly push the torque curve to the left, my understanding tells me theres very little impact at the upper ranges as the cam profile retards back to 0º advance after 5k or 5.5k rpm. Another good one to look at to see just what can be done is SilverFox's M50B30 race build. 230ish rwhp and a healthy shot of torque too. Only difference to your setup is an M50B25NV exhaust cam to replace the 288º stock stick, S50 pipes but he had his DME remapped by Gavin. Great work Warren, would be cool to see a rolling road dyno printout to see what the actual numbers are at the rear treads Should be able to give a few of the M boys a bit of a scare now! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jibs05 86 Report post Posted November 1, 2015 Thanks. From what I can see as a difference between our setups is: M3 Cams No MAF Cold Air Intake M3 EVO Headers Link G4+ ECU with a Dyno Tune Not sure what exhaust you're running - I'm using a M3 Exhaust with CAT delete + AdrenalineR 2 in + 2 out resonator. To add M3 cams you'd have to add vanos or make a modified vanos to non-vanos adapter for the inlet cam. Everyhting else is pretty easy - although the M3 EVO Headers may not fit the E30... It's all possible - you can do it too!! (just need a nice fat wallet). I've got m52b28 headers modded to fit the e30, and a 3"mandrel bent exhaust (mildsteel) two flowmaster mufflers. Just a chip tune for now, AFRs look safe under load part throttle and WOT. I think some cams would definitely help mine breathe better, i'll most likely get a reground cams. No link for me $$$ haha but i'd like to get a piggyback. A nice fat wallet is something i don't have haha Oh yes, subd. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Time for an update. Over the last few weeks I've been tidying up the last few things that were a bit rushed during the initial install. I was also having some trouble with the water temperature in the head fluctuating which may have been related to where the expansion tank had been installed temporarily during the install. It's now been relocated to the front again on the corner of the radiator and the temperature issue appears to be resolved - possibly small air pockets getting trapped?? The other major is the clutch. It's never worked correctly since installed. It disengages most of the time when the pedal is right at the floor but sometime doesn't quite fully disengage. I've had to remove the second carpet and the rubber stop on the clutch pedal which gave the pedal an additional 5mm movement. It disengages a bit better now but is still crap. What's worse is when it's hot, changing gear becomes a roulette game - will it crunch into gear or not!! I purchased a NZAD D1 Racing Clutch with lightened 6.5kg Solid Flywheel. They have not been able to help at all and cannot supply any form of support (dimensions, drawings etc) and just keep stating they've never had a problem before. It may just be my specific configuration but lack of support means I can't really figure out what is wrong either. So, I'm dumping the D1 Racing Clutch and getting a custom one built at KBM. It will be early next year before I can get in to have it installed so I'll just have to suffer in my jocks in the meantime. The carbon granules in the evaporative emission control canister have been replaced + the canister has been relocated to make space under the inlet manifold - much better. Here's what the engine bay looks like now: The new mount for the expansion tank. This doesn't fit the Fenix all-ally radiator and an ally bracket has to be fabricated + high quality cable ties with a stainless tongue used to hold it on. I stll need to add the low-level switch back - is ordered and should arrive next week. Relocation of the evaporative emission canister. The tape is only to hold it together while the glue sets. About the only thing left in the engine bay to fix up is the crankcase ventilation pipe - M50 vs M52 has a few differences... I need to find a solution to tidy up this make-it-fit solution: Once this is done it will be time to focus on the outside of the car. It's a bit rough in places. I had it repainted about 5 years ago but the guys doing the painting turned out to be sharks. The resulting job initially looked ok but isn't lasting. It stone chips really easily and now looks worse after 5 years than it did on the original paint at 18 years... I'd like to do another paint job at same stage + fix up all the window rubbers and other old parts showing their age. This will have to wait for about a year though - no surpises, funds are bit low after the engine job... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael. 2313 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Very cool, good to see what extra capacity and tuning can do. That is a very solid engine output Must drive really well! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Must drive really well! Thanks. Mmm, yes and no... It has plenty of grunt and does go really well (especially compared to how it was) + it's a real hand-full in the wet. But, the additional torque is seriously showing up all the old stretched suspension components. I think it won't just be an external tidy-up of the car required - new tight suspension components all round too + changing the 15's to 17's on the next tyre change. I'd like to go to the early style M3 double spoke rims. Also looking at suspension options to lower it just a little and get Bilsteins all round + matching springs (has Sachs now). It will be a while before I can actually do any of these upgrade though - will just have to dream about it for a while :-) 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tawa 150 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 The other major is the clutch. It's never worked correctly since installed. It disengages most of the time when the pedal is right at the floor but sometime doesn't quite fully disengage. I've had to remove the second carpet and the rubber stop on the clutch pedal which gave the pedal an additional 5mm movement. It disengages a bit better now but is still crap. What's worse is when it's hot, changing gear becomes a roulette game - will it crunch into gear or not!! I purchased a NZAD D1 Racing Clutch with lightened 6.5kg Solid Flywheel. They have not been able to help at all and cannot supply any form of support (dimensions, drawings etc) and just keep stating they've never had a problem before. It may just be my specific configuration but lack of support means I can't really figure out what is wrong either. I just bought one of those last week for my M52B28 w Getrag 220; while it isn't the exact same setup as yours, I'm happy to do some engineering (measuring, fab, etc) to help you try and get yours going right, unless you've already pulled the trigger on that other one? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Thanks muchly for the offer but I have already committed to changing. There is supposed to be quite a big difference between the 220 & 420 - not so much the flywheel/clutch/pressure plate but the release arm and slave - apparently... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michael. 2313 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Thanks. Mmm, yes and no... It has plenty of grunt and does go really well (especially compared to how it was) + it's a real hand-full in the wet. But, the additional torque is seriously showing up all the old stretched suspension components. I think it won't just be an external tidy-up of the car required - new tight suspension components all round too + changing the 15's to 17's on the next tyre change. I had the same issue when I put a 1UZ V8 into my E36, it was pretty crap with the stock worn suspension - more power / torque - but couldnt use it properly! 3-4k later I had a whole rebuild M3 Evo setup fitted with OEM parts and the results were just night and day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tawa 150 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Thanks muchly for the offer but I have already committed to changing. There is supposed to be quite a big difference between the 220 & 420 - not so much the flywheel/clutch/pressure plate but the release arm and slave - apparently... No problem, just read through the whole thread, complements for such a thorough writeup; I'll likely be refering back to this for a few mods on mine... Few pics of the whole car couldn't go amiss though Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrs 120 Report post Posted November 28, 2015 Yeah, I suppose I should put up some pics of the car. It's nothing flash and needs some work to tidy a few things up which is why I haven't put any up yet. I guess I'll have to wash it and take a few... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
