Help! E30 wof failure for one stupidly small reason.

[NZ300E 44]

I am head scratching at the moment and wonder if someone could help. Went for a warrant and my beloved e30 failed on one thing. The little green indicator light on the dash for when turning left does not light up. Great I thought, easy fix....removed cluster, put in a known working bulb to see if that was the problem, but no.   This is what I have come up with so far....turned on hazard switch, relay ticks, right light goes, left does not. Tried indicator stalk, relay in column ticks, both on left and right...right bulb goes,left does not. A couple of questions arise, if the relay is switching on and off (ticking) is that an indication that it is functioning properly. And if using indicator stalk and relay ticks is that an indication the stalk switch if functioning properly. Could it be a break in the circuit board somewhere or more likely a faulty/dirty switch........help appreciated. Would not like this to be the thing that keeps it from being warrantable,specially when the rest of the car is so good.

 

cheers

Edited October 18, 2016 by NZ300E

[nick496 268]

So I might have missed it, but when you indicate left, the cluster light doesn't flash, but your indicators do? 

If so, would recommend you try swapping your cluster out. 

[NZ300E 44]

Yep you got it.   Everything is working fine apart from the cluster flasher. Which peeves me that my car is not considered road worthy because of that. 

[NZ00Z3 187]

Suggest that a wiring diagram and volt meter are going to be needed to do some proper fault finding rather than throwing parts at an unknown problem.

 

[NZ300E 44]

Thanks for that. With my silly logic, if the stalk switches on the relay, then the stalk is ok. If the hazard switch is sending power to the relay/ right indicator light. Then the hazard switch is ok. And if the bulb works and is making a good connection, then that should be ok. My conclusion being it is either a break in the circuit in the cluster (worst case) or there is a fault between the relay and the cluster. What do people think.

[gjm 3258]

I think you've nailed the two areas where the fault could lie. Which it is will be more difficult to determine without investigation.

Could be the bulb holder for the cluster indicator, or connectivity to it.

[huff3r 347]

Pretty common for the clusters to develop dry solder joints, so could be worth tracing that, however I have never heard of issues with indicator indicators (pun intended), generally more fuel gauges, and brake light warning circuits (the resistor used is so big and heavy it often breaks the solder).

[NZ300E 44]

Cheers. Checked the bulb holder, took the back off the cluster and it looks to be all good just on a visual. There looks to be no corrosion or cracked solder joints. Of course I could be wrong.....time to get the meter across some circuits as suggested.

[NZ300E 44]

Well.....had the meter out, checked a few things. Still got me stumped. So frustrating that this is what keeps me off the road legally. Can anyone tell me if this ruling is correct. It is not a warning light but an advisory light. I know the indicators are going because of the relay sound. But the attitude was if it has a light then it has to work.

Anyway the problem is above my knowledge so will probably have to take it to someone more qualified. 

:-(

Edited October 20, 2016 by NZ300E

[NZ00Z3 187]

Do you have a wiring diagram to work by?

The fault could be in the -ve (earth) or the +ve (signal) side or both.  

 

Start at the bulb holder to identify which side to fault find.

- is there an earth connection when tested to another +ve power source?

-Is there a signal pulse when tested to another -ve chassis earth?

 

Once you know which side the fault is on, work your way back towards it source (fuse or chassis earth bolt) using the wiring diagram to find the fault.

[huff3r 347]

See here: https://vehicleinspection.nzta.govt.nz/virms/in-service-wof-and-cof/general/lighting/direction-indicator-lamps

Look at point 22.

Quote

22. A visual lamp indicator device does not operate.

 

Yes it is a legitimate fail.

[NZ300E 44]

Bugger

[emandru 17]

not sure what item 22 actually refers too.  If it is indeed the interior light or the exterior flashing light.  At the bottom of the document it defines an lam indicator as "

Direction indicator lamp means a lamp designed to emit a flashing light to signal the intention of the driver to change the direction of the vehicle to the right or to the left." Might actually be worthwhile discussing further?

[gjm 3258]

I'd not heard of a WoF fail based on an internal lamp repeater lamp not working - that means nothing as I'm not a WoF tester. ABS lamp, airbag lamp (and other similar warning lamps) - fair enough. However, I have been told that the cluster lights not working to illuminate the speedo etc is a fail.

Some rural WoF testers will ask the owner to sit in the car and operate the indicator stalk, brake pedal and light switches. In that situation the presence (or lack thereof) of a cluster repeater for the indicators would go unnoticed.

This could also be the difference between a 'by the book' tester (nothing wrong with that) and one who will assess a car as being safe, or unsafe and representing a potential hazard to the driver or other road users: the lack of an internal indicator repeater may not be regarded, by some testers, as making the vehicle unsafe or unroadworthy.

[huff3r 347]

The point they will probably use is that the internal indicator device will indicate a fault (by flashing faster, or not at all) when the indicators themselves fail, and with it not working then a fault could go unnoticed. In practice you can hear it too, but when a visual indicator is present it should work.

 

Might be worth trying another cluster if you can borrow one, will rule out a cluster fault at least.

[NZ300E 44]

Thanks guys. All good points.

It does make you wonder if I went somewhere different would I get a different result. Where do you guys go? Mainstream places like vtnz or dealers. Or to a private garage. Or local "mate" mechanic. I'm sure we have all been there. Especially with our older vehicles.Where you think something is marginal and you might be able to fudge it through by going somewhere different than if you had a near new car.

Edited October 22, 2016 by NZ300E

[Haitoman 110]

Look, get a bit of twin wire. Parallel it up to the left external indicator and run it back to the bulb holder on the cluster (isolate it first). Get your warrant, and worry about it later.

[NZ300E 44]

And the winner for bodge job the year goes to........

 

Might actually consider that. Cheers

[LemonHunter 583]

I would recommend re-flowing every solder connection you can see, it won't hurt it but might fix this issue and defer others that will happen with time.

 

 

[NZ300E 44]

Fixed!!!  Once again this site proves it's worth.

Traced it to faulty earth to that bulb. Got a bit of wire touched the earth on the bulb and connected the other end to a known earth.....it worked. So instead of tracing where the break might be, Ijust connected a spare bit of wire from the bulb to an earth source and zipped the patient back up. Done.

Thanks to everyone again, much appreciated.