E30 M325i

[gjm 3193]

Lovely car.

How would we go about proving, indisputably, that a given example is a genuine M325i ? (In the absence of original paperwork.)

The spec can be extrapolated from the VIN, but 'just' having the bodykit, M-Sport parts, suspension, 15" BBS rims and so on does not necessarily a M325i make. Documentation from dealers is scant, at best, assuming it still exists.

Being able to categorically say a given car is a M325i is probably only important at sale time as they do command a premium over other well-specified E30s.

[Neil McCauley 248]

Not really sure I understand the question? Should be fairly black and white - if the spec sheet has option code 333 for an mt1, and 335 for an mt2 it's an m325i. 

All of the m325i goodies were also a either factory option, or available as dealer retrofit aside from one, which is the black headliner - it wasn't even listed as an option if you run the vin of an m325i, so if it's got the headliner, you can be fairly sure you're looking at the genuine article. 

 

[C-130 Hercules 556]

... And you can always email BMW Classic classic@bmwgroup.com 

[gjm 3193]

2 hours ago, Neil McCauley said:

Not really sure I understand the question? Should be fairly black and white - if the spec sheet has option code 333 for an mt1, and 335 for an mt2 it's an m325i. 

All of the m325i goodies were also a either factory option, or available as dealer retrofit aside from one, which is the black headliner - it wasn't even listed as an option if you run the vin of an m325i, so if it's got the headliner, you can be fairly sure you're looking at the genuine article. 

Code 333 is for 'Light Alloy Wheels Star-Spoke Style 105 With Mixed Tyres.' It doesn't denote a 'M325i' - as I understood (I could well be wrong!) the M325i was not a BMW factory car. It was a NZ dealer special created from selected parts, in response to the M3 not being sold here. As such, no amount of factory-original VIN decoding is likely to help.

However, the car I'm helping with has:
S333 Light Alloy Wheels Star-Spoke Style 105 With Mixed Tyres
S339 Shadow-Line
S704 M Sports Suspension
S708 M Sports Steering Wheel Leather

It also has the other options associated with a M325i, including:
S481 Sports Seat
S209 Differential Lock 25%

Most telling (for me) though is a VIN decode 'feature' which appears common to all M325i cars:
S333 Light Alloy Wheels Star-Spoke Style 105 With Mixed Tyres
S288 BMW Light Alloy Wheel, Cross Spoke 29
S311 Light-Alloy Wheels Star-Spoke Style 69 Brilliant

Note that the M-Tech bodykit is not mentioned in the VIN decode as (again, as I have understood) this was dealer-fitted in NZ as a part of the M325i spec. It could also have been ordered from te factory but was typically not a feature of the M325i cars.

 

The black headliner is an interesting one. 👍  I'll check on that.

 

[gjm 3193]

2 hours ago, C-130 Hercules said:

... And you can always email BMW Classic classic@bmwgroup.com 

Not sure they'll be able to help as if the M325i was a NZ-only (dealer-prepared) car they are unlikely to have any relevant info.

(Let's not get mixed up with the 325i Sport!)

[Neil McCauley 248]

@gjm The NZ m325i was definitely a factory car - the black headliner was never an E30 option, so it could never have been a dealer-prepared. Option codes have shifted over the years, what was an option code back in 1990 might come up as something different in 2023. 

Here's a pricelist from '89 for reference.

 

Also for reference here are most of the E30 option codes:

199 - Equipment for leaded fuel
200 - Catalytic convertor
206 - 5spd sport transmission
209 - LSD (25%)
215 - Power steering
222 - Electronic damper control
225 - Sports suspension
240 - Leather steering wheel
270 - Audiosystem US
286 - 14” Weaves
288 - 15” Weaves
289 - 16” M3 Weaves
296 - TD-LM/200/60x365
300 - Central locking
301 - Alarm system
308 - Locking glovebox
311 - Electric passenger mirror
314 - Heated washer nozzles / Drivers door lock
320 - Badge delete
326 - Rear spoiler delete
330 - Japan Sport Pack
333 - M Technic sport pack (M-Tec I)
335 - M Technic sport pack (M-tec II)
339 - Shadowline
350 - Green tinted glass
351 - Brown tinted glass
354 - Green stripe windscreen
359 - Visibility pack
361 - Hinged rear windows
400 - Manual sunroof
401 - Electric sunroof
410 - Electric windows, front (coupe)
411 - Electric windows all round (4dr)
415 - Sunblind for rear window
423 - Velour floor mats
428 - Warning triangle
464 - Ski bag
481 - Front sport seats
494 - Seat heating
497 - Centre arm rest in rear
498 - Rear head rests
500 - Headlight wash system
510 - Headlight beam throw control
520 - Foglights 
530 - Air conditioning
535 - Electronic temperature control
540 - Cruise Control
545 - Tachometer / kph speedo
548 - KPH speedo
551 - OBC II with remote control
562 - Map reading lights
570 - Stronger electricity supply
675 - Premium audio
680 - Holder for aluminium cases (?)
681 - Roof antenna (M3)
682 - Automatic antenna
687 - Radio preparation
690 - Cassette holder
704 - M Technic suspension
708 - M Technic II Steering wheel
728 - Edition ZV
750 - Basis for comprehensive edition
790 - M3 Evolution (M3)
792 - Small Motorsport package (M3 Evo II)
795 - Special Model 89 (M3 Ravaglia)
804 - Switzerland version
806 - NZ preparation / 3rd stop light
807 - Japan preparation
810 - Australia preparation
812 - England version
813 - France version
814 - Italy version
819 - Spain version
823 - Hot climate version
827 - Scandinavia version
829 - Convertible conversion preparation
850 - Fuel added for export
853 - Language version English
854 - Language version French
855 - Language version Italian
856 -  Language version Spanish
860 - LTRL TURN SIGNAL LIGHT FRT
899 - Export vehicle
915 - Only conserves soil?
925 - Shipping protection package
945 - “Captivating. PRICE dependencies” BERUECKS. PREISABHAENGIGKEIT (press pack?)
 

Edited August 18, 2023 by Neil McCauley
Spelling

[Sammo 2477]

I can’t imagine there are many NZ New Mtech 2 manual 2 doors with black headliner kicking about and if there are, no doubt Bimmersport knows about them.

Eg the reshelled Schwarz one for sale currently.

[darren_mk 52]

13 hours ago, gjm said:

Not sure they'll be able to help as if the M325i was a NZ-only (dealer-prepared) car they are unlikely to have any relevant info.

(Let's not get mixed up with the 325i Sport!)

What is everyone's opinion on the differences between a  UK 325i Sport and a NZ new M325i?

I am from the UK and assumed the Sport was essentially the same as a NZ M325i - just a name difference? and as stated the best way to tell is a black headliner.

[Sammo 2477]

2 hours ago, darren_mk said:

What is everyone's opinion on the differences between a  UK 325i Sport and a NZ new M325i?

I am from the UK and assumed the Sport was essentially the same as a NZ M325i - just a name difference? and as stated the best way to tell is a black headliner.

Same car essentially - same as Australian 325is.

But not NZ new obviously - and I think UK sports and 325is came in autos which was not the case for the M325i.

[Palazzo 427]

4 hours ago, Sammo said:

I can’t imagine there are many NZ New Mtech 2 manual 2 doors with black headliner kicking about and if there are, no doubt Bimmersport knows about them.

Eg the reshelled Schwarz one for sale currently.

Don’t they all have black headliners if they are m325is? Or am I misunderstanding your question?

[Sammo 2477]

1 hour ago, Palazzo said:

Don’t they all have black headliners if they are m325is? Or am I misunderstanding your question?

Correct - I mean if it’s one that’s been retrofitted with one, the Bimmersport hive mind (or @Neil McCauley) may already be aware of it.

Edited August 19, 2023 by Sammo

[Neil McCauley 248]

UK Sport has the close(r) ratio 260/5 gearbox with shorter ratios between 1st and 3rd gears:

G260 - 3.83 / 2.04 / 1.34 

G260/5 - 3.72 / 2.02 / 1.32

The UK Sport wasn't available as an auto.

@Palazzo I assume @Sammo meant NZ new mt2 coupes WITHOUT the black headliner. Team McMillan had a red one for sale back in 2001 for $16,995 but they wouldn't take my 60K mile Jaguar Sovereign on trade 😂 can't remember the rego though... I have a sneaking suspicion it was the zinnobar one recently for sale.  

 

[darren_mk 52]

Hi Neil, so the NZ new M325i only had the ‘standard’  G260?

I can remember the difference in the ‘boxes was quite noticeable when driving. 

 

[Sammo 2477]

1 hour ago, Neil McCauley said:

UK Sport has the close(r) ratio 260/5 gearbox with shorter ratios between 1st and 3rd gears:

G260 - 3.83 / 2.04 / 1.34 

G260/5 - 3.72 / 2.02 / 1.32

The UK Sport wasn't available as an auto.

@Palazzo I assume @Sammo meant NZ new mt2 coupes WITHOUT the black headliner. Team McMillan had a red one for sale back in 2001 for $16,995 but they wouldn't take my 60K mile Jaguar Sovereign on trade 😂 can't remember the rego though... I have a sneaking suspicion it was the zinnobar one recently for sale.  

 

This is some preposterous knowledge dropping!

[Neil McCauley 248]

Bored on a Saturday night, crunched the colour numbers of MT2 still on the road in NZ:

6 Lachsilber 

11 Diamantschwarz

4 Alpinweiss

2 Delphingrau ( @Palazzo is your old one still on the road?)

1 Zinnoberrot

5 Sterlingsilber

4 Brilliantrot

UK Sports: 1 Lachs / 2 DS / 1 AW / 1 Delphin / 1 Brilliantrot (C2 2.5 Alpina) / 1 Granitesilber.

Japan Mtechnic 325i's - 2 or 3 so far. 

There will be more, and there are plenty that have been written off. 

[gjm 3193]

6 minutes ago, Neil McCauley said:

Bored on a Saturday night, crunched the colour numbers of MT2 still on the road in NZ:

...

If you're still bored, could you do the same for MTech 1 cars? I think these were only built in 1986 and 1987.

[Neil McCauley 248]

3 (4) Polaris kiwi new in '86

5 Lachs

5 Diamant (one not registered until '89)

Can't find any NZ new Delphin

UK Sports: 2 Delphin / 2 Diamant / 3 Lachs

Edited August 19, 2023 by Neil McCauley

[Palazzo 427]

10 hours ago, Neil McCauley said:

Bored on a Saturday night, crunched the colour numbers of MT2 still on the road in NZ:

6 Lachsilber 

11 Diamantschwarz

4 Alpinweiss

2 Delphingrau ( @Palazzo is your old one still on the road?)

1 Zinnoberrot

5 Sterlingsilber

4 Brilliantrot

UK Sports: 1 Lachs / 2 DS / 1 AW / 1 Delphin / 1 Brilliantrot (C2 2.5 Alpina) / 1 Granitesilber.

Japan Mtechnic 325i's - 2 or 3 so far. 

There will be more, and there are plenty that have been written off. 

Happily sitting in my dads garage, having just had a new(er) LSD fitted.

[e30ftw 394]

I bought a diamantschwarz m325i as a parts car about 10 years ago. Interior was in parts, body had a fair amount of rust. Probably would have been worth saving in hindsight considering the condition of e30s these days 😆 

[gjm 3193]

I have some pics of the car in question, and it is for sale. This was entirely an attempt to ensure that if it were to be described as a M325i in any advertising, that the car would in fact be a M325i.

It has a black headlining.  

I'm not the seller of the car, but have been sent some pics. I'm waiting for contact details for the seller before listing it - depending on what the seller wants to do, contact may be via me, or may be direct to the current owner. However, until that is sorted, I'll sit tight.

It's not a fabulous, minty-fresh, unmolested example as some changes have been made over the years, but pricing will reflect that. 

[Sammo 2477]

17 hours ago, gjm said:

I have some pics of the car in question, and it is for sale. This was entirely an attempt to ensure that if it were to be described as a M325i in any advertising, that the car would in fact be a M325i.

It has a black headlining.  

I'm not the seller of the car, but have been sent some pics. I'm waiting for contact details for the seller before listing it - depending on what the seller wants to do, contact may be via me, or may be direct to the current owner. However, until that is sorted, I'll sit tight.

It's not a fabulous, minty-fresh, unmolested example as some changes have been made over the years, but pricing will reflect that. 

Whats the colour, out of interest?

[gjm 3193]

2 hours ago, Sammo said:

Whats the colour, out of interest?

(Another) Diamant-Schwarz.