ED1RTY 2 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Last night around midnight i wake up to security lights outside at the neighbors (they happen to be my grandparents) look out my window.. Two scumbags walking up past my grandads car (in the carport as i use the garage) I get up rather quickly, get semi-dressed and go for a look outside with torch/golfclub. Two polynesian/moari munters take off down the drive.. not being sure if i could whack them one and not get charged with assault I went and called the cops.. While on the phone to the cops i hear a snap and a window smash.. They are breaking into another neighbors garage... Cops arrive, 5 or 6 minutes later and check area etc Dont find anyone.. This is where i have a question.. Can i give the ****'s a whack and not get prosecuted? Is 'civilian arrest' frowned upon by NZ's legal system? I'm interested to know, as soon as somebody steps on my property ESPECIALLY my grandparents it irritates me.. Much like the amount of abuse and disrespect for elderly that has been in the media recently. That is probably only a small proportion of what really happens.. Purse snatching etc some of it get a bit violent i'd bet.. These **** bags need to get a life, get a job, and learn some ****ing respect for other peoples property. [/rant] Edit, just finished writing this and saw a 85 y.o was beaten in his rest home for a laptop. It sickens me to think how someone could do that! :angry: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Creaver 55 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 I agree wholeheartedly. Total bullshit. I still can't get over the fact that a farmer who shot someguy with his shotgun as they were trying to steal his quadbike was prosecuted and done for protecting his property/family... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oscar90 0 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 +1 with all thats been said Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danbullock 15 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Yeah mate, next time just whack 'em and plead ignorance when the cops turn up, i'm sure they won't really care. Just don't kill em, thats when you get into trouble. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ED1RTY 2 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Yeah mate, next time just whack 'em and plead ignorance when the cops turn up, i'm sure they won't really care. Just don't kill em, thats when you get into trouble. Haha i'd love to think so!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bravo 34 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Chris - the law is murky. A law lecturer once advised our class not ever to make a citizen's arrest. Even though you may not get prosecuted, often the perp gets off as it muddies the legal waters so to speak, then if they do get off they can ask the police to lay charges on you for unlawful imprisonment and assault or some sh*t. I may not have it all right, but the advice was to not. That said, if you confront them and they attack you, you can use reasonable force to defend yourself. You can demand they leave, if they don't its trespass. If they attack you it's assault, if they damage property its wilfull damage, if they pick up an object and attack you its assault with a weapon or aggravated assault, and so on. Which gives you a fair license to retaliate. I wouldn't recommend it though. Chances are you'll get your head kicked in, or you'll go too far and the legal system will pwn you, or they'll take off only to come back with fellow meatheads and weapons to "sort you out". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ED1RTY 2 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Cheers MOF.. Pretty much sums it up.. Got a meeting with cops tomorrow about it all.. Dairy got help up at knifepoint yesterday evening also.. Seeing how stupid they were after breaking in next door when they clearly saw me..... Could be the same 'meatheads' Im keen to start a vigilante 'crimewatch' squad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bimmer boy 21 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Just go for the kneecaps Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3series 0 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 need some nightrider lights on the frront of kSMYRS Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elmarco 56 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 I actually don't think the cops have a lot of choice with prosecuting this kind of thing if you take it into your own hands. They don't make the law, and have to refer it to a higher authority to decide (ie: the courts). So expect some time to 'discuss it' with Bubba the 7ft wrestler if it isn't a self defence no-brainer.... Having said that, I think these scum deserve a good beating - seems to be the only thing some of them understand. The problem is that while it makes people like us feel better to know those pieces of sh*t have had a valuable life lesson, it just escalates it. I really have no idea what the answer is - but am pretty sure more Police dogs that get fed less frequently is a damn good start. My 2c. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Driftit 1951 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 What about they attacked me and I defended myself? Judge is more likely to be on your side in that situation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yuen 16 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 This is where i have a question.. Can i give the ****'s a whack and not get prosecuted? Is 'civilian arrest' frowned upon by NZ's legal system? We'd hope that's the case, but didn't that dairy owner get charged with assaulting the teenagers when it was a case of self defense? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolliver 1 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 the legal system will pwn you hahahahahhahahahahahaha Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
e30plz 1 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Agree with everything thats been said.. Really pisses me off, Who the.. would beat up an 85 y.o. for a Laptop.. WTF~! I really have no idea what the answer is - but am pretty sure more Police dogs that get fed less frequently is a damn good start.Man Bear Pigs, That will teach them not to f**k with peoples property.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 1 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 (edited) What about they attacked me and I defended myself? Judge is more likely to be on your side in that situation. they probably could do with a beating but there so many situations when weapons end up being used against the person who brought them. Just tell them to f**k off, and let the cops know. My little bros bike got pinched a while back, found some teenage punks with it round the block. I confronted them, got into an argument, got it back then called the cops by which time they'd gone. The cops actually caught them when they (sh*t-for-brains) ran into a shop and called the police themselves. Turns out they were being chased by someone who's house they'd broken into. Fricken genious. Worst thing was they were only 16, we had to go through all that family court victim crap. Little punk just sat there pulling faces while his trailer trash mum tried to say he was actually a good boy. little homo probably never been told off in his life. Definite case for "self defense" whack or they'll take off only to come back with fellow meatheads and weapons to "sort you out". hah - anyone see that case at hutt high. half a dozen gang members went into the school looking to deal to one kid. The half the school jumped on the gang and kicked the crap out of them. Gang got arrested, charged, and a few broken bones. Where are they breeding these specimens? Edited April 16, 2009 by Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Livi 0 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 All i can say is this area has so many meat heads its not funny. Once when we had new neighbours they tried to break into my old car luckily it had an alarm and they noticed it just as they were about to break the window luckily they have now moved!! Theres alot of violence as well , people having fights rarara. and then me getting signs pulled at me while driving past people , i believe they should all be put onto one deserted island. I would like to think if someone was trying to break into either my evo or the bmw that i could run out with a baseball bat and hit them on the knee caps or something so they cant run...then let the cops do the rest. and also! when my brother parked his brand new work car *he worked for buy right cars* , it was a brand new subaru outside my house , some little sh*ts tagged all over it with a spray can and he had only parked it there for an hour!!! so over people around here who have no respect or anything for anyone else but themselves! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3_Power 636 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 (edited) Chris - the law is murky. A law lecturer once advised our class not ever to make a citizen's arrest. Even though you may not get prosecuted, often the perp gets off as it muddies the legal waters so to speak, then if they do get off they can ask the police to lay charges on you for unlawful imprisonment and assault or some sh*t. Can't have been a very good law lecturer to say that ... the law on Citizen's arrest is fairly clear in my opinion, the problem is the citizen's don't actually know what they can and can't do. Edited April 16, 2009 by M3_Power Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gus 5 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 ^^ of course, you wouldn't actually want people to stand up for themselves.. people do need to take more responsibility - crime happens because people let it happen, not because the cops are inefficient - they cannot be everywhere. Don't live in fear - too many people turn a blind eye to sh*t going down Some legal protection exists to those making a citizen's arrest as provided in the Crimes Act 1961 in that there may be justification or protection from criminal responsibility. Justification of the arrest ensures the arresting person is not guilty of an offence and are not liable to any civil proceeding. Protection from criminal responsibility means those who make the arrest are not liable to any criminal proceedings. They are however liable for civil proceedings. The legislation is carefully worded and only applies for offences covered in the Crimes Act 1961, not other offences such as those covered in the Summary Offences Act 1981.[16] Specifically, the Crimes Act 1961 states that everyone (not just New Zealand citizens) is justified in arresting without warrant:[17] Any person found committing any offence against the Act which the maximum punishment is not less than 3 years' imprisonment; or Any person found at night committing any offence against the Act. Other situations where members of the public are protected from criminal responsibility when involved in arresting where: They have been asked by a police officer to help arrest any person believed or suspected to have committed any offence unless they know that there is no reasonable ground for the belief or suspicion.[16][18] They witnesses a breach of the peace, and therefore are justified in interfering to prevent its continuance or renewal, and may detain any person committing it, in order to hand them over to a Police Officer provided that the person interfering does not use more force than is reasonably necessary for preventing the continuance or renewal of the breach of the peace, or than is reasonably proportionate to the danger to be apprehended from its continuance or renewal.[19] Similar legislation applies to suppressions of riots by members of the public.[20] They believe, on reasonable and probable grounds, someone has committed an offence against the Crimes Act 1961 and is fleeing and is being pursued by any one they believe can arrest that person for the offence (such as a police officer). This applies whether or not the offence has in fact been committed, and whether or not the arrested person committed it.[21] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike.Gayner 0 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 I agree wholeheartedly. Total bullshit. I still can't get over the fact that a farmer who shot someguy with his shotgun as they were trying to steal his quadbike was prosecuted and done for protecting his property/family...That's a completely absurd opinion. Shooting someone if they present immediate physical harm to you is fine, but shooting someone in the back as they ride away on your quad bike isn't. He wasn't protecting his family, he shot a guy in the back as he ran away, which is cowardly. No matter what opinion you have of the thief, human life > quad bike. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 If we didnt have theives... no one would shoot and no one would get shot Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3 SERIES 92 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 That's a completely absurd opinion. Shooting someone if they present immediate physical harm to you is fine, but shooting someone in the back as they ride away on your quad bike isn't. He wasn't protecting his family, he shot a guy in the back as he ran away, which is cowardly. No matter what opinion you have of the thief, human life > quad bike. You mean thief > quad bike Not question about it.......quad bike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martyyn 2 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 I agree wholeheartedly. Total bullshit. I still can't get over the fact that a farmer who shot someguy with his shotgun as they were trying to steal his quadbike was prosecuted and done for protecting his property/family...Oh right, because shooting someone in the back is 'reasonable' is it ?Im sorry Ian, but thats a really stupid thing to say. Your allowed to use reasonable force to contend with any 'force' they might be using. Shooting people is not the answer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OLLIE 26 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 At the end of the day, I blame bad parenting and bad education as the rot of the problem. These problematic people need to be dealt with at an early age. What really pisses me off is when the police press assault charges against the likes of a model citizen store owner with a clean record for hitting a mongrel looking meathead after he allegedly tried to steal from hi store. I don't believe this sh*t should be allowed to make the courts, I mean honestly how f**king black and white does it need to be? (pardon the pun) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
E30BMA 0 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 I agree Ollie, comes back to responsibility. If they learn at an early age that they can get away with it, then of course they are gonna keep doing it. If all you get is a "slap on the hand" its worth the effort, as they've probably gotten away with it 10 times before that and never got caught. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pjay 8 Report post Posted April 16, 2009 Bring back the biff I got disciplined physically as a child and I believe I'm a better person from it. f**k all that nanny sit in the corner, you've been bad sh*t Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
