Andre3000 55 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 About to replace the afm with a straight pipe, and before i do this i wanted to check if theres anything i should know? Im assuming aluminum is the way to go, but is there anything wrong with a silicone pipe? Is there any fabrication needed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mark247 38 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 (edited) About to replace the afm with a straight pipe, and before i do this i wanted to check if theres anything i should know? Im assuming aluminum is the way to go, but is there anything wrong with a silicone pipe? Is there any fabrication needed? Well you are gonna still want the AFM because it will run like crap without one. EDIT: if you dont have a replacement set up obviously Edited May 14, 2009 by Mark247 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smiddy 76 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Hi Andy,what fuel/air metering system are you useing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JiB 0 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 From the little that I know, it's a fairly costly exercise. Alpha N/MAP sensor mods needed to get the motor running. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boost Junky 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 About to replace the afm with a straight pipe, and before i do this i wanted to check if theres anything i should know? Im assuming aluminum is the way to go, but is there anything wrong with a silicone pipe? Is there any fabrication needed? Your AFM tells your ECU how much air your motor is receiving so that it knows the right ammount of fuel to add to the mixture just before it all enters the motor... only way to do without an AFM is to run a MAP sensor which as far as I know is only feasable through running an aftermarket ECU like LINK or equivelant. Luke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mark247 38 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Your AFM tells your ECU how much air your motor is receiving so that it knows the right ammount of fuel to add to the mixture just before it all enters the motor... only way to do without an AFM is to run a MAP sensor which as far as I know is only feasable through running an aftermarket ECU like LINK or equivelant. Luke I have been told by someone that you can get the loom from an M50 and use it on an M20 with a bit of modification, which means you can use the M50s MAP sensor... ECU I guess as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boost Junky 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 I have been told by someone that you can get the loom from an M50 and use it on an M20 with a bit of modification, which means you can use the M50s MAP sensor... ECU I guess as well. Mark, M50 also uses AFM, well.. not sure who told you this but as far as I know I have never heard of M50s running MAP sensors from factory. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Not quite, M50 uses MAF, which is a little different to AFM. I remember reading somehwere about adapting an M50 loom to an M20, with the right sensors attached and a re-map to suit I think it could work. But then why use the shitty M20, just go with a complete M50. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boost Junky 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Not quite, M50 uses MAF, which is a little different to AFM. I remember reading somehwere about adapting an M50 loom to an M20, with the right sensors attached and a re-map to suit I think it could work. But then why use the shitty M20, just go with a complete M50. Oh right but they still use a tubular type unit with a sensor in the middle correct? Either way you would have to still run it inline with the intake piping setup. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Yip, M20 is flappy paddle (AFM) while M50 uses hot wire sensor (MAF). Both sit in the middle of the intake somewhere. The names are sometimes interchanged as they both measure airflow (but in a different way) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boost Junky 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 Yip, M20 is flappy paddle (AFM) while M50 uses hot wire sensor (MAF). Both sit in the middle of the intake somewhere. The names are sometimes interchanged as they both measure airflow (but in a different way) Right got ya! Thanks for clearning that up Mike. So your typical RB/SR/VG30 meters are AFM as most people call them or paddle type? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike 1 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 I'm pretty sure most of the nissan ones are heated wire, or Mass Air Flow (MAF). They are still an Air Flow Meter (AFM) however, which is where the confusion comes from. Flappy paddle style only directly measures volume, not mass. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_flow_sensor should explain most of it. We've gone a bit off-topic here. To answer the original question, assuming you have the correct ECU to function with the AFM then pretty much anything will work, aluminium, stainless, PVC pipe even. Most people run a pod filter and then a few bends and pipe to get to the throttle body, a few brackets a normally required to keep it all in place. What exactly did you have in mind? and what were you hoping to achieve? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apex 693 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 About to replace the afm with a straight pipe, and before i do this i wanted to check if theres anything i should know? Im assuming aluminum is the way to go, but is there anything wrong with a silicone pipe? Is there any fabrication needed? Bosch Auto Electrical in Papakura can fit a MAP-ECU which is essentially a piggy back that deletes the ultra restrictive AFM and replaces it with a MAP sensor and a custom tune on a rolliing road.. Cost is about $1,500 and includes before and after dyno sheets and a detailed run down as to what they have done. They will also retune your car down the track at a reasonable cost if you decide to do any other mods. I have seen some great results with one of these. There is a member on here MrE34 that has one fitted to his 535is and it yielded great results. Would find it but the search feature is ball sacks. I want one fitted! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Creaver 55 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 (edited) ^^ Isn't that APT? Or have I got them mixed up? *edit* Have a read of this. It also does appear to be APT. - http://www.bimmersport.co.nz/forums/index....amp;hl=map-ecu* Edited May 14, 2009 by Creaver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 After reading all the above Andrew... you will now realise that it WON'T work with NOTHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ewie 0 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 (edited) A little OT I know but the MAF isn't that ideal a solution if you planning on using performance filters, especially like K&N or other oil impregnated versions. My 2005 Subaru Legacy GTB ran an MAF and I had a K&N filter installed, as reccommended by Wingers at the time.. anyhoo about a month or so later the car started running really rough and would "surge".. took it into Wingers to check it out and waddya know, the MAF was malfunctioning because of fine oil mist depositing on the wire sensor.... Winger initially were'nt going to cover it under warrenty until I produced a reciept showing they were the ones that fitted it in the first place. Just thought I'd mention it... Edited May 14, 2009 by **Ewie** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 A little OT I know but the MAF isn't that ideal a solution if you planning on using performance filters, especially like K&N or other oil impregnated versions. My 2005 Subaru Legacy GTB ran an MAF and I had a K&N filter installed, as reccommended by Wingers at the time.. anyhoo about a month or so later the car started running really rough and would "surge".. took it into Wingers to check it out and waddya know, the MAF was malfunctioning because of fine oil mist depositing on the wire sensor.... Winger initially were'nt going to cover it under warrenty until I produced a reciept showing they were the ones that fitted it in the first place. Just thought I'd mention it... Thats very true... dont use oiled type air filters with MAF sensors Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CamB 48 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 There is a member on here MrE34 that has one fitted to his 535is and it yielded great results. Would find it but the search feature is ball sacks. There is a writeup of his car on the MAPECU site: www.mapecu.com ---> Results, Press, scroll to the right. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew 30 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 There is very little loss through the AFM on E30s, at least on my racecar the restriction is somewhere else on the intake system. Having said that it is possible to remove it on the factory ECU and use a MAF sensor with a bit of an ECU tweak and some additional hardware. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DRTDVL 0 Report post Posted May 14, 2009 I know in pug land, we can upgrade to the VW golf mrk 3 vr6 MAF as an "upgrade" as it's larger and flows better... usually giving only throttle responce Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andre3000 55 Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Ok sorry guys i should have explained that im running a map ecu2 system, and that the device runs off absolute manifold pressure instead of air flow. I need to run a straight pipe from air box to throttle body, with a air temp sensor in the pipe. What i was wondering is that, can i use a silicone pipe? and has anyone had any experience with this? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bravo 34 Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Either will be fine as long as it has no leaks and is of resilient material such as silicone hoses designed for the purpose. If silicone is ok for boosted systems, it's ok for you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted May 15, 2009 What a bloody waste of time that was ^^^^^^^ up there The right info will get you the right results Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CamB 48 Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Won't you need an alloy pipe with a boss welded in for the air temp sensor? Certainly that's what I'm planning. I can't see how you can attach the air temp sensor to a silicone pipe? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kerrynzl 3 Report post Posted May 15, 2009 What a bloody waste of time that was ^^^^^^^ up there The right info will get you the right results Hahahaha! I was thinking about starting a thread about chanding my wheels After I get about 60+ replies, I'll mention it was because one had a puncture [ point taken Glenn ] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
