NZ new i8 for sale in Welly

[TermiPeteNZ 1318]

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a.aspx?id=1448708074

• $145K
• 9000KMs
• 3 owners ...

Edited October 25, 2017 by TermiPeteNZ

[aja540i 1906]

I still have trouble associating $145, 000 with a 1.5 litre 3 cylinder car!

[Olaf 3317]

I'd have no trouble making that association if I won lotto this weekend.

Mind you, I'd want some money off for a good interior detailing, it looks a bit dusty 

[Olaf 3317]

Just now, Olaf said:

NZ New i8, selling behalf of friend, the car have everything i8 should have. no test drive unless proof of fund provided.

What kind of fund are they referring to?  Trust fund?  Slush fund?  Consolidated fund?

Is the i8 in fact the preserve of the Trustafarian?  I think we should be told. 

[Gabe79 410]

4 hours ago, aja540i said:

I still have trouble associating $145, 000 with a 1.5 litre 3 cylinder car!

I dunno, if I had it, I'd pay that kind of money for a Tesla.

[Michael. 2313]

Next year it will be 100k  

[Olaf 3317]

yeah, a tidy e30 M3 is probably a better speculation, the i8 will continue to devalue.  

make a good Uber ride? For single-ride passengers flying carry-on only...

[Gabe79 410]

35 minutes ago, Olaf said:

yeah, a tidy e30 M3 is probably a better speculation, the i8 will continue to devalue.  

make a good Uber ride? For single-ride passengers flying carry-on only...

You may be right for the i8 specifically, i don't know.

 

For Teslas, they do not devalue very much at all... The low end of EVs do devalue, but again, not actually quite as much as one would think.

[Michael. 2313]

1 hour ago, Gabe79 said:

 

For Teslas, they do not devalue very much at all... 

Yet.....

[Gabe79 410]

38 minutes ago, Michael. said:

Yet.....

Erm... confused. Teslas don't devalue much, or at all on a  3-5 year timeframe. Who cares what happens later? What other car can this be said about them?

[M3AN 4016]

Until the batteries need replacing... then they're worth $0.

 

[Gabe79 410]

35 minutes ago, M3AN said:

Until the batteries need replacing... then they're worth $0.

 

This isn't right. Batteries can be replaced. The cost is not too dissimilar to the cost of replacing an engine. Major difference being you get no benefit from a cost perspective from replacing an engine, where replacing a battery not only gives you all the financial benefits of EVs back (cost to run/maintain is massively smaller than any ICE car), but the value of the car goes right back up. 

[M3AN 4016]

1 hour ago, Gabe79 said:

This isn't right. Batteries can be replaced. The cost is not too dissimilar to the cost of replacing an engine. Major difference being you get no benefit from a cost perspective from replacing an engine, where replacing a battery not only gives you all the financial benefits of EVs back (cost to run/maintain is massively smaller than any ICE car), but the value of the car goes right back up. 

Umm, but you shouldn't expect to replace an engine over the life of the car, that's not the case for batteries.

If the up-front cost of an EV included lifetime battery replacements then the comparison could be valid.

 

[Gabe79 410]

1 minute ago, M3AN said:

Umm, but you shouldn't expect to replace an engine over the life of the car, that's not the case for batteries.

If the up-front cost of an EV included lifetime battery replacements then the comparison could be valid.

 

The longest mass-market hybrid around, the 1st gen Prius, had batteries that last 10ish years.

Even if you factor in a new battery as costing, say, $10k (they don't cost that much) and your Leaf lasts you 10 years (note the batteries will last longer than that, just with lower range and we're nearly 20 years on in battery technology from the 1st gen Prius... these numbers are guesstimates) factor in $1000/year on maintenance over the cost of the car. You will have saved a lot more than that number in petrol alone over that time period. 

My point was not that you'd have to replace an engine over a car's lifetime. I was simply suggesting that it isn't too different in scope, with the major difference that replacing an engine doesn't really jack up the value or your car, whereas replacing an old battery with a brand new one does jack up the value of an EV. 

I think folks are really missing the economics here. Electricity is vastly cheaper than petrol, in every sense. Even dirty electricity is cleaner than petrol when it comes to EVs. It costs maybe 30% of the petrol cost. 

Figure out how much you spend on fuel+maintenance. EVs cost 30% your fuel bills and your only maintenance items are tyers and breaks. It doesn't compare.

[hotwire 352]

5 hours ago, Gabe79 said:

My point was not that you'd have to replace an engine over a car's lifetime. I was simply suggesting that it isn't too different in scope, with the major difference that replacing an engine doesn't really jack up the value or your car, whereas replacing an old battery with a brand new one does jack up the value of an EV. 

I think folks are really missing the economics here. Electricity is vastly cheaper than petrol, in every sense. Even dirty electricity is cleaner than petrol when it comes to EVs. It costs maybe 30% of the petrol cost. 

I can't see that a new battery will jack up the value of an "old" electric car anymore than a new engine will an "old" petrol car. Both scenarios just make the vehicle usable again. Cars (most) are simply commodities now & devalue with age.

I really can't grasp this "electric" thing yet, the Hybrid still has a petrol engine producing pollution but this concept is required if you need any form of decent range which a fully electric vehicle cannot produce.

Also with electrics, almost no one, including the greenies, think of the resources required to both produce & dispose of these batteries. Doesn't make for a very environmentally friendly option.

I do see electric vehicles as the answer BUT running on via a fuel cell & NOT by batteries.

[Gabe79 410]

Just now, hotwire said:

I can't see that a new battery will jack up the value of an "old" electric car anymore than a new engine will an "old" petrol car. Both scenarios just make the vehicle usable again. Cars (most) are simply commodities now & devalue with age.

I really can't grasp this "electric" thing yet, the Hybrid still has a petrol engine producing pollution but this concept is required if you need any form of decent range which a fully electric vehicle cannot produce.

Also with electrics, almost no one, including the greenies, think of the resources required to both produce & dispose of these batteries. Doesn't make for a very environmentally friendly option.

I do see electric vehicles as the answer BUT running on via a fuel cell & NOT by batteries.

A lot of greenies do think about the process end to end... there is a thread about this and some good research gone into the topic posted of end to end emissions for EVs here. The numbers don't back up your claim that it is not an environmentally friendly option, to the contrary...

 

There are a couple options in the 'Electric' space.

There are EVs, which have relatively short range, and are fully electric, no petrol whatsoever. Range per charge varies. I have an old-ish Leaf, with my style of driving, I get 80km to a charge. On a fast charger, it takes 20 minutes to charge back up to 80%, or I plug it in overnight at home.

There are Hybrids, and their newer brethren, Plug-In Hybrids. These run mostly off petrol, but for short distances (varies, but 10km is a safe bet) these can run off their electric battery and use no petrol. Older hybrids charged the electric battery off the petrol engine, newer ones still do that with the additional option of charging that electric battery from a wall socket. Because of how hybrids operate, they can get really amazing range/petrol efficiency, this is why so many taxi companies, and uber drivers choose the Prius. 800km range is not bad.

[hotwire 352]

I am aware of the operation of electric vehicles.

I am not denying they will emit less greenhouse than a diesel

My reading of that - there is talk of the resources to produce the battery as being not so attractive. My point. Imagine the resource required if half the worlds fleet switched to battery powered electric.

It still seems somewhat backward to me (for the future) to run a petrol (assisted) electric vehicle or a fully electric (battery powered), which in context, has a very limited range.

A fuel cell powered electric makes much more sense. yes there is an infrustructure to set up but once its done its done. 

[Gabe79 410]

8 minutes ago, hotwire said:

I am aware of the operation of electric vehicles.

I am not denying they will emit less greenhouse than a diesel

My reading of that - there is talk of the resources to produce the battery as being not so attractive. My point. Imagine the resource required if half the worlds fleet switched to battery powered electric.

It still seems somewhat backward to me (for the future) to run a petrol (assisted) electric vehicle or a fully electric (battery powered), which in context, has a very limited range.

A fuel cell powered electric makes much more sense. yes there is an infrustructure to set up but once its done its done. 

Not all electrics have crap range. The Leaf sure does, and we don't have a lot of options here in NZ, but there are good EVs with meaningful range in other countries, excluding Teslas. The Chevy Bolt has range that's quite alright, 370km on a charge. The Renaut Zoe can go 400km on a charge. The bottom end Tesla model S can go 330km on a charge. I think it gets pedantic to say the range isn't as good as a ICE car. Who cares at that stage? Note, even the relatively limited Leaf, in the right situation has no real range issues, it just has to suit your needs (and would never be an only car...)

Also, obviously, battery technology is improving by leaps and bounds every year. The Leaf batteries were originally projected to degrade a lot faster than they have been, and they are improving and gaining capacity every year. Current model Leaf batteries have 3 times the capacity my 2011 model has. I don't imagine that come 2020, or much less 2030, or 2040, range for EVs will be an issue at all. I do wonder what else will be available then though. Ah, the future is bright.

[allan 295]

Would be interested to compare the two vehicle types in the materials that are used. How these materials them self are made and what process used to see what the carbon foot print is of both.It is all good to say the electric car is less pollutant than the petrol but the materials / processes used could far out weigh any gains  The i8 has some interesting materials used I believe this was highlighted when reading an article about what special care needs to be taken to these vehicles when they come up for disposal .

Edited October 26, 2017 by allan

[Autoglym 255]

I wonder if that is the same one I saw with crash damage & it was parked outside Arlington’s in Newtown?

[BreakMyWindow 1874]

10 hours ago, Gabe79 said:

Ah, the future is bright

Ummm not if you like the sound of an ICE and the character of its power delivery. Electric power is just one step further away from what an engaging drivers car is all about imo. They cater for the masses who see cars as a means of transport. The tree huggers are also kept happy. 

 

What a sad future.

[M3_Power 636]

Where batteries come from ... it’s the new blood diamond.

[Michael. 2313]

Meanwhile... 

[Gabe79 410]

49 minutes ago, BreakMyWindow said:

Ummm not if you like the sound of an ICE and the character of its power delivery. Electric power is just one step further away from what an engaging drivers car is all about imo. They cater for the masses who see cars as a means of transport. The tree huggers are also kept happy. 

 

What a sad future.

If it's how the car sounds... we can have speakers.

I think Tesla's shown performance, or power delivery, in EVs is quite not bad. In fact, even in the Leaf, pushing the gas pedal to the floor results in quite a satisfying feeling, even as compared to my 530i.

[Gabe79 410]

12 minutes ago, Michael. said:

Meanwhile... 

As opposed to an internal combustion engine? I'm confused.