e30 m20 turbo stroker project

[Mike 1]

I have twin post GM coils. Looked like too much work to get started wanted to try stock coil first but even that looks like a POS to setup..

What setup were you planning on running when you brought it? wasted spark or single coil? or using motronic to keep doing the spark? IMO I'd go with a wasted spark setup, grab some mitsi ignitors and coils and wire the sucker up, wiring diagrams are all over the net. Or for a cleaner install you can use the GenIII GM coils which have the ignitors built in, costs a bit more though.

I wouldn't recommend this but you could switch to the old dizzy setup on pre-fl 320i and 323i, not a good idea as you really should have proper spark control with a boosted setup. will get you started and let you get the fuel sorted though.

[Guest FrantiC]

I wanted to go wasted spark eventually, But for now wanted to get it running and set off the front dizzy..

I have a box with 8 coil ignitors. I lo9st the wiring diagram for it though.. And I have a set of 3 twin post GM coils, from a buick. Apparently a common use with megasquirt.

I am amateur as with electronics...

[CamB 48]

Wait wait. Lets confirm what you've done first.

So - you have a megasquirt setup for 3x ignitors and 3x dual post coils. You have, instead, hooked up 1x megasquirt ignition output to 1x ignitor, yes?

If so, 2 questions:

1) what did you do to the other 2x ignition output wires?

2) can you check spark on all six plugs - there is a possibility that 2x are working, and all you have to do is change a setting or two in megatune so its using 1x ignition output not 3x.

Edited June 26, 2009 by CamB

[Guest FrantiC]

I have done nothing so far.

All I have done is:

Plugged in the MS adapter loom.

Wired up the +12V power for the relay, for power to megasquirt.

Wired and confirmed variable TPS works.

wired in the IAT and LC1 wideband.

Then I had connected the coil to the loom as per usual and the rest to the dizzy etc.

Then I figured out, The coil is not grounding and it's nor sparking.

So now I need to figure out how to wire the ignition because yeah it doesn't work like that apparently and I don't know how to wire the coil driver which I need apparently.

[Guest FrantiC]

AFAIK, megasquirt is setup to run a single coil also. the GM coils were there as an upgrade really, which the guy never did.

[CamB 48]

Have been looking at the megasquirt manual and megatune - works different to what I thought (despite having read it before!). I have the way my Link works in my head.

So, did the megasquirt you have bought run with the GM setup or an ordinary coil when it was last used?

Edited June 26, 2009 by CamB

[Guest FrantiC]

I bought it and it was used with the stock dizzy.

[CamB 48]

OK, that's curious.

So are you using an ignitor?

(ignore what I said in earlier posts about multiple ignition channels by the way - it seems that's not how MS works unless it is specifically built with multiple coil outputs).

Edited June 26, 2009 by CamB

[Guest FrantiC]

OK, that's curious.

So are you using an ignitor?

(ignore what I said in earlier posts about multiple ignition channels by the way - it seems that's not how MS works).

Nope, I don't know if I am or not?

I don't think I am, as the guy told me I need to wire the ignitor box to the coil, not sure how or what he meant.

[CamB 48]

What does the ignitor box say on it (brand and part numbers).

[Guest FrantiC]

It says

Coil Driver

© 2008

EFI SOURCE

REV 1.0

3308

And thats all on the circuit board.

[CamB 48]

Basically, I would expect you have two choices (the way I read it):

1) Your MS has a coil driver built in - you can wire the coil negative directly to the MS as per this:

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/vb921.htm

2) Your MS doesn't have a coil driver and you need an ignitor, which connects to the coil negative and to the MS, as well as having its own power and ground:

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/Bosch_124.htm

[Guest FrantiC]

It is this coil ignitor:

http://www.efisource.com/products.php?category=1

The 8 channel one, though the cover is blank doesn't have anything written on it, only the circuit board.

[Guest FrantiC]

Basically, I would expect you have two choices (the way I read it):

1) Your MS has a coil driver built in - you can wire the coil negative directly to the MS as per this:

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/vb921.htm

2) Your MS doesn't have a coil driver and you need an ignitor, which connects to the coil negative and to the MS, as well as having its own power and ground:

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/Bosch_124.htm

I have MS1 V3, Not megasquirt2.

[CamB 48]

Oh, ok - it looks like the wiring for the ignition for V3 is the same as for MS-II though:

Note that you should read the appropriate section of the MS-IITM EFI Controller manual for the V3 board - it contains much more wiring information that may be important for your installation:

# Stepper IAC

# On-Off/PWM FIdle Valves

# Distributor Pickups

# Knock Sensing

# GM HEI

# GM DIS

# Ford EDIS

# Ford TFI

# Bosch 0 227 100 124

# MSD 6A

# Direct Coil Control

The DB37 pin #36 is an output, used to control an ignition module, or control a coil directly (if the high current ignition driver circuit is installed). It only needs to be connected if you are controlling ignition timing and dwell.

I dunno how that ignitor works. I'm a simple dude - once the ignitor does more than the 4 connections I mentioned above, plus a tach signal, I start getting confused.

(edit) Does it have labelled terminals?

Edited June 26, 2009 by CamB

[Guest FrantiC]

Oh, ok - it looks like the wiring for the ignition for V3 is the same as for MS-II though:

I dunno how that ignitor works. I'm a simple dude - once the ignitor does more than the 4 connections I mentioned above, plus a tach signal, I start getting confused.

(edit) Does it have labelled terminals?

Nah, I just know it's 1 to 8 and each corner is a ground, so there are 4 grounds, 8 inputs and 8 outputs. (10 connections each side)

[CamB 48]

That works like no ignitor I've ever seen then. Did it run with that ignitor in the previous owner's hands? Or did he use a different ignitor or direct to the coil?

[Guest FrantiC]

Thats the thing, I have no idea at all...

I don't know what I am meant to do, what to wire up or what lol.

Anyways I am out for a night of drinking so I shall continue my quest to find out WTF I need to do tomorrow

[Mike 1]

There heaps of different ways to do this which makes it really hard to say what you should be doing, as I have no idea whats been done before. Normally, you'll be running it off the on board ignitor which is then wired to the coil. The ignitior basically tells the coil when to fire. (3 times per revolution for dizzy 6 cyl) If you have an adapter I would have thought this would be already taken care of. Other issue is that US spec cars could be a bit different to Euro versions.

Have you got the megatune issue sorted yet? Dont even bother trying to sort any other issues until you have that sorted.

You could go onto DIYautotune website and download their version of megatune and the firmware, then flash that to the MS. it worked fine for me.

What version MS and board is it? (cant be bother reading through to find it if youve mentioned it already sorry)

[CamB 48]

Normally, you'll be running it off the on board ignitor which is then wired to the coil. The ignitior basically tells the coil when to fire. (3 times per revolution for dizzy 6 cyl)

Its MS1 V3, I believe. Is the coil driver definitely built into V3, or is it an optional extra (that might not be there)?

Coz if its definitely there, it occurs to me the ignitor isn't needed...

Edited June 26, 2009 by CamB

[Guest FrantiC]

Yep, MS1 V3. Will check if my ECU has a built in coil driver, I guess it should ? Not sure how this guy was using it if it' not wired up already. Arghhhh.

[Mike 1]

Depends how good a job the guy did when he built it, i added all the circuits when I built mine as other than a bit of extra work there was no reason not too. Its most likely there if he was running using the dizzy, I doubt he was using an external ignitor

[Guest FrantiC]

No idea, working on finding that out now. Hasn't e-mailed me back in a while, trying to figure how he had it going.

[Guest FrantiC]

Heres the reply I got from the guy...

There is one on the ms, check that the wiring is correct for your car, if it is and you are still not getting any spark, double check the wheel decoder settings. If all that checks out, check the ignitor its self, if the car was left in 'on' position for a long time, it could have potentially burnt out. If that is the case, you can either jumper the pins on the board and wire in that box to spark one, or you can simply wire the box to FIDLE and set that as spark 1 in megatune. That's the reason for having extras in the box, they can fail pretty easily if you do something wrong. If you know anyone with a stimulator that will be helpful in setting up the wasted spark.

[Greg111 13]

If it all gets too much John i'd recommend taking it to Clare electrical, they would be able to sort it out quite fast, i would lend a hand but when it comes to these aftermarket ECUs it's all a bit iffy to me.