VANOS EXPLOSION! S54 M3 engine needed...

[m325i 709]

This thread is scaring me off an m3 big time !

Edited February 3, 2013 by Nick G

[M3_Power 636]

Anything in particular you'd get checked per-purchase, Tom?

I might recompile my list actually as it really needs updating.

But if you can get your hands on a diagnostic machine that records vanos actuation in real time then hook it up to the car and drive around in it - I've done this a couple of times and you can tell if the system is functioning correctly quite easily from it - if it's not switching timing smoothly and correctly you get spikes in the real timing graphs.

But in my opinion these are the biggest issues you really need to check on the E46 M3:

1. Rear subframe floor mounting area, rear wheel well (the infamous rear subframe mouting cracks - check inside boot and from under the car (any cracks in the seam seal, walk away)- if you can lift up the rear seat bench (it's not hard just pull the front up and slide it out) - the first of the points to go is the front driver side - this shows up under the seat bench along the seam seal and around the seat belt buckle area if serious enough. But definitely have the car up on a hoist to check - The next one to go is the rear left. If the RTAB, rear lower arm bush, diff busings and rear subframe bushings look worn - WALK AWAY. Check also the wheel wells - I've seen cars where the cracks are developed here first, not the actual floor mount.

2. Listen for rattles with the vanos unit - hook it up to a diagnostic machine that reads real time if you can and check that the vanos is operating correctly. Unfortunately without opening the cam over, you won't be able to tell for sure if anything is cracked or about to sheer off.

3. Check service history - if it didn't get regular oil service ... walk away - or buy a spare motor haha.

4. Front control arm bush (the lollipop one) these only last about 30,000km max ... Similarly the RTAB.

5. broken rear spring - very common.

6. oil leak near the CPV (Constant pressure valve) - I suspect this also causes a lot of the failures and people ignore it thinking it's just another typical bmw oil leak - this valve is critical in ensuring oil pressure and it's near the exhaust headers so hard to spot.

7. rear diff seal leaks - very common and pain in the arse I have to say ... (both side including the main seal which is an arse to replace.

You also get a lot of sensor faults on this car ... DSC pressure (the two on the brake master cylinder, I've yet to see one that hasn't had one of these sensors replaced), cam and crank position, air temp, O2 pre and post cat (usually bank 2 on the post and bank 1 on the pre cat - don't ask me why, I've yet to figure this one out).

There's lot more ... but the top few are the ones I'd check thoroughly ... if it's an SMG car ... I'll have to come back on that one as there are way more things that can go wrong with those unfortunately!!

2.

Edited February 3, 2013 by M3_Power

[Tristan 338]

Thanks mate.

This is making me rethink buying an SMG.

Edited February 3, 2013 by Tristan

[M3_Power 636]

This thread is scaring me off an m3 big time !

It's about finding a good car ... like I said you only ever hear of the ones that have had catastrophic failures ... you never really hear about the ones that have done 200k km ...

The big end bearing failure is another one I forgot to add to the list above - but presuming the car was NZ new it should have been recalled.

Do your home work and research before you buy one. I think the mistake a lot of people make about the E46 M3 is people think they can afford to keep this car going because the car is now very cheap to buy, but they forget this was a $140k car when new and a very highly strung high revving motor. Heck the motorsport version of these motor only made 420hp and lasts a couple of hours ... the standard motor isn't really far from that horsepower and it is suppose to last at least 100k km trouble free.

The other thing to be mindful I think about the s54 is that there's a whole wealth of knowledge out there now about these (even to the extent in the ability to remove vanos completely and run it on the stock standard DME system by writing it out of the codes) - so in a way it's comforting to know that should something go wrong, at least there is a whole knowledge base out there that allows you to read up on how to fix things .... try that with an Audi ... I couldn't even find a resource to tell me how to take the rear plastic trim panels out of an A3 the other day - shocking!!

Edited February 3, 2013 by M3_Power

[Apex 693]

Inspected, yes. Overhauled, no

I suspect also that a lot of these failures are due to improper maintenance to be honest.

The service interval for the s54b32 is 25,000km .... by the time that oil comes out of that motor it's like sludge.

25,000km is crazy for any car let alone a M car, is that honestly what is recommended i the service book? I would think it would have burnt all of its oil over that time frame in any case? I would be doing mine every 10,000km like I do all my cars.

What I was getting at is that if M3 owners took their cars to BMW dealerships and had the car serviced as recommended I doubt that these issue would arise, I'm guessing that it mostly comes down to second owners who cant afford to have them looked after properly so skimp on proper preventive maintenance. Its the third owner who pays the price and in association gives the car model a bad name... nothing new.

[M3_Power 636]

25,000km is crazy for any car let alone a M car, is that honestly what is recommended i the service book? I would think it would have burnt all of its oil over that time frame in any case? I would be doing mine every 10,000km like I do all my cars.

What I was getting at is that if M3 owners took their cars to BMW dealerships and had the car serviced as recommended I doubt that these issue would arise, I'm guessing that it mostly comes down to second owners who cant afford to have them looked after properly so skimp on proper preventive maintenance. Its the third owner who pays the price and in association gives the car model a bad name... nothing new.

I actually think it's the original recommended service schedule that screw these cars up to be honest.

The E46 M3 came out at a time when "free servicing" was the thing to have included in buying a new European car - BMW were the first of the luxury three to do it and they basically had the same type of servicing interval across the full range ... M car or not.

Heck, they even gave the car so called 'life time' gearbox oil ... And this is on a car without a gearbox oil cooler and often see failures because of overheated gearboxes.

The service interval was 25,000km or every 2 years ... but I can tell you that to save money, most of the cars were serviced on the km travelled rather than the 2 yearly recommendation. For what is little under $400 at the dealership, this engine deserves a yearly oil change regardless.

[NZ BMW 368]

25,000km is crazy for any car let alone a M car, is that honestly what is recommended i the service book? I would think it would have burnt all of its oil over that time frame in any case? I would be doing mine every 10,000km like I do all my cars.

What I was getting at is that if M3 owners took their cars to BMW dealerships and had the car serviced as recommended I doubt that these issue would arise, I'm guessing that it mostly comes down to second owners who cant afford to have them looked after properly so skimp on proper preventive maintenance. Its the third owner who pays the price and in association gives the car model a bad name... nothing new.

I think 25k is too long also but just considering your two statements, if it is 25k then it seems the BMW service interval is simply too long.

But I thought these cars had the "smart" monitoring of the service interval. So if you wait for the car to tell you it adjusts based on the driving.

[M3_Power 636]

Condition based servicing wasn't available on the E46. I believe the first to get that were the E60 followed by the E90s.

[hybrid 1043]

But if you can get your hands on a diagnostic machine that records vanos actuation in real time then hook it up to the car and drive around in it - I've done this a couple of times and you can tell if the system is functioning correctly quite easily from it - if it's not switching timing smoothly and correctly you get spikes in the real timing graphs.

Should have my system for testing this sorted very soon

Am writing a specific diagnostic page at the moment for VANOS including a warning system. Will sort it for MSS54/S54b32 soon too.

PS .. just emailed you some pics of the prototype Tom

[M3_Power 636]

Should have my system for testing this sorted very soon

Am writing a specific diagnostic page at the moment for VANOS including a warning system. Will sort it for MSS54/S54b32 soon too.

PS .. just emailed you some pics of the prototype Tom

Nice one Josh : )

[jeffbebe 1559]

Should have my system for testing this sorted very soon

Am writing a specific diagnostic page at the moment for VANOS including a warning system. Will sort it for MSS54/S54b32 soon too.

PS .. just emailed you some pics of the prototype Tom

Very cool. Will you be able to test single vanos M52B28? I've been toying with the idea of replacing the seal but would love to do it because I know it will improve power delivery instead of hoping that it might. I'm prepared to pay for this kind of service but not the kind of sum BM workshop want for it.

[hybrid 1043]

Anything from about '96 onwards and has a newer gen DME hopefully. Havent got to MS43 yet, but im sure it supports the message system I need write the diagnostics for it.

[Apex 693]

I think 25k is too long also but just considering your two statements, if it is 25k then it seems the BMW service interval is simply too long.

But I thought these cars had the "smart" monitoring of the service interval. So if you wait for the car to tell you it adjusts based on the driving.

I'm guessing if you looked in the E46 owners manual or even followed the service instructions on the OBC the actual service intervals would be 10-15km, I cant remember what it was on ours but it was not as high as 20km, hence why I questioned where the 25km figure came from

Any self respecting service agent would recommend a minimum of 10,000km service intervals on a M car, most would know that the M cars burn so much oil that a close eye must be kept on them!

[euroriffic 609]

I was looking into buying a e46 m3. Now I'm thinking I'd be better off with an e30 m3. Thanks for the insight Tom.

[Allanw 1071]

I'm guessing if you looked in the E46 owners manual or even followed the service instructions on the OBC the actual service intervals would be 10-15km, I cant remember what it was on ours but it was not as high as 20km, hence why I questioned where the 25km figure came from

I assume the non M E46's are similar to the M54B25 in our E39, which works on 2350 litres of fuel. With our average fuel consumption (lots of town driving) of 10.3L/100 kms, it works out to around 22800kms. If it's been serviced like that all it's life, it's done it no harm - the inside is VERY clean - I was a bit worried when I took the rocker cover off to do the Vanos seals as to what I might find, but I was pleasantly surprised. It may have always had the correct oil in though.

I have changed the Service Interval litres to give me a service interval of about 15K, which is fine for an engine run on the correct oil with 6.5L on board.....

... but as mentioned - probably not ideal for an M3 that gets a work out every now and then!

[Ahmedsinc 414]

Bloody hell, that sends a chill up the spine Out of curiosity, is there any record of other vanos systems throwing the same tantrum?

[Greg111 13]

Ahh good ol' S50s.

[hybrid 1043]

+1

[M3_Power 636]

I'm guessing if you looked in the E46 owners manual or even followed the service instructions on the OBC the actual service intervals would be 10-15km, I cant remember what it was on ours but it was not as high as 20km, hence why I questioned where the 25km figure came from

Any self respecting service agent would recommend a minimum of 10,000km service intervals on a M car, most would know that the M cars burn so much oil that a close eye must be kept on them!

The OBD counts down from 25,000km ... I know because mine was reset last year and it's the first time it has been reset to that. Despite that I've already had countless oil changes and one inspection 1 done regardless.

[central3 31]

IMO the joys of the S54 are well worth the risks involved. To reduce the risk you can inspect the vanos oil pump drive tabs and the cam bolts by removing the cam cover. Doing this enables you to clearly see the tabs and you can also see the ends (but not the heads) of the cam bolts. Given that they generally come loose before any catastrophic failure you can get a high level of comfort from seeing whether all of the bolts are evenly engaged in their camshaft flange drillings. The job only takes 4 or so hours for the average home mechanic – on a scale of 1 to 10 the job difficulty is about a 3.

If this isn’t enough for you (it wasn’t for me) you can disassemble the vanos and check the bolts more thoroughly (in my case I removed, inspected, loctited and torqued them). I also crack tested the tabs (refer my post in the maintenance section). To do this you need the camshaft alignment/check tools (plus the crankshaft lock tool) and the BMW TIS. The job difficulty goes up to a 5/6 but only adds an hour to the cam cover off job duration. Beware some of the easier DIY’s on the web as they are just plain wrong in their method. Tools and TIS are the one and only way and it (i.e. the TIS) is not onerous.

[Neal 544]

The OBD counts down from 25,000km ... I know because mine was reset last year and it's the first time it has been reset to that. Despite that I've already had countless oil changes and one inspection 1 done regardless.

Have you ever had analysis of the oil done after an oil change ?

Normally the oil has no problem in terms of it's properties at this amount of km's unless the car only gets short runs or sits around too much (track days as well). Need to remember that it's not shared with the gearbox as with other engines and will last longer. Quick visual check via the oil on the dipstick will give a reasonable indication.

[MondoM3 0]

Thanks for all the good info guys. Im learning a lot. Unfortunately the hard way.

Still weighing up my options. At this stage im still leaning towards purchasing a used engine. However i want to explore all options first.

Obviously I would much rather have the original engine rebuilt, even if I have to outlay a few more thousand dollars to do so. But if its twice the price of a 2nd hand engine, i just cant justify it.

Anyone out there have a VANOS unit that has been removed from their engine thats up for sale??? Ive been told by several race car builders and wreckers that some guys like to bypass the VANOS all together and run fixed timing. Therefore there must be at least a few units floating round somewhere? If I can source a 2nd hand vanos setup, the rebuild is looking possible.

Again, thanks for the info.

[Neal 544]

Failing getting a unit in NZ you talk with these guys http://www.drvanos.com/index.php?option=co...=5&Itemid=6