Valve Stem Seals for '07 550 with 4.8 V8

[awake 1]

My '07 550 (100,000 km NZ new) has just been diagnosed with leaking valve stem seals.  Plus it looks like oil is leaking out of every other engine orifice so it needs attention as the oil is spilling on to rubber hoses etc.  I have been given a price to do all the seals at $5,200 to fix this.  Has anyone else had this issue and had it fixed?  What was the cost and who did it for you?  I am trying to see if I can find a better price to have this work done.  This quote BTW is NOT from a BMW franchise dealer....  

[Young Thrash Driver 1020]

Owners of these engines worldwide are finding this is a feature of the engine... an "easter egg", if you will. I suspect the quote is on the money, no personal experience but I know that it is a very involved job.

The oil leaks are generic to most BMWs.

[Eagle 1662]

@Olaf may have some info but these cars are cheap for a reason.

[Breaker 980]

It is an inherent issue, I’ve heard values over 10k so likely on the money, once done they apparently are a great engine again

[Gaz 1061]

That's prob at the cheaper end of the scale already I'd say. If they are doing the seals with the heads in place it's a very labour heavy job which is where all your cost is going. I would go for someone who has experience in doing the job rather than the cheapest. Also be prepared for a number for extra hoses that will also require replacement due them being old and brittle

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2132]

wouldnt be too upset about that price. though would talk to a BMW specialist and/or main dealer as well who have the correct tools for the job. bear in mind it is a fools game going to the place with a $20 an hour less labour rate when they spend twice as long to fix the problem.

All the V8s need to come out through the bottom of the car so they can be worked on, there is no room in the engine bay to complete this task. bear in mind you are also paying for the fact the car hoist is tied up with your engineless car on it for a period of time that the bay could otherwise be generating revenue.

[hotwire 352]

And still my e39 sounds very attractive to stick with.

Andy - you are spot on with the labour thing. Still amazing the amount of people who ring & ask our labour rate  - thinking it is the be all & end all.

[Gaz 1061]

13 hours ago, _ethrty-Andy_ said:

wouldnt 

All the V8s need to come out through the bottom of the car so they can be worked on, there is no room in the engine bay to complete this task. bear in mind you are also paying for the fact the car hoist is tied up with your engineless car on it for a period of time that the bay could otherwise be generating revenue.

There's a tool which allows you to do it without removing the engine but it's a very tight fit. The correct BMW way is to remove the heads and do the guides as well but it's become pretty standard to do just the seals with it all in place

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2132]

1 hour ago, Gaz said:

There's a tool which allows you to do it without removing the engine but it's a very tight fit. The correct BMW way is to remove the heads and do the guides as well but it's become pretty standard to do just the seals with it all in place

not on the V8, but you are correct for the I4 engines. BMW pull the engine on V8 E60s and X5s

[Gaz 1061]

55 minutes ago, _ethrty-Andy_ said:

not on the V8, but you are correct for the I4 engines. BMW pull the engine on V8 E60s and X5s

Can be done with the engine as we (Christchurch BMW) have done it but it is easier with it out.

[awake 1]

Yeah the guys who quoted me said they do the job with the engine in, they use some special tool using compressed air to push the valve up and then another to compress the spring so they can work on it in situ.  While they were describing this to me they pointed out an X5 in the workshop that they were doing the same job on.  Said they need the car for 4 days....  

[hotwire 352]

^^^ That procedure for valve stem replacement is a common way to do in situ. I have done on engines in the past

[dirtydoogle 383]

I have an excellent snapon tool for these horrid jobs, works with the majority of motors. 

It is a very involved job, I would say that quote is reasonable 

[Olaf 3318]

Hi Folks.  Yes, as @Eagle Jared points out, my 2004 e60 545i was diagnosed and subsequently sorted.  I think e60 V8's are inexpensive because they're unfashionable and don't have a Holden Commodore on the badge!  They're an amazing car, and well optioned-up cost around $160-180k new?  We're buying them under $20k with deferred maintenance; they're going to need some lurrrvvvvvv.   So put on your Barry White (or your Marvin Gaye), settle in, and read a little about my case.  ⛑️

• oil leaks were all sorted under previous custodian's care.  @TermiPeteNZ had already addressed plenty of the maintenance items; I took up the mantle when I bought it, and expected there'd be more to do.  I wasn't disappointed.  The good thing was it wasn't covering hoses with oil, or ruining the alternator, like it sounds is the case in yours, Geoff @awake  
• On we strolled, taking care of the systems that might be smokey, while catching up on other items.
• Firstly the PCV diaphragms were were replaced.  They're an inexpensive part, on top of each head.  They get old and brittle.
• Secondly, vacuum pump replaced.  it was weak, Brakes were not firm enough, and was not scavenging oil as expected.  
• Oil consumption was increasing, and it was 'puffing billy' after sitting at traffic lights.?️  Valve stem seal failure was subsequently diagnosed.

Yes, Valve Stem Seal failure an issue with the N62 V8's... though the same seals are used in MANY, MANY BMW engines.  Don't be in such a hurry to roll out smugfaces, you M54 owners!  Oh, yeah that's me too. Damn.  ?

Fortunately, I have kept up** maintenance, and the MBI is still valid.  Thank you Autosure Extreme.  Seriously.  Thank you Autosure Extreme.  And Page European, here in Wellington.  

Yes, you may have been following my SS Commodore in German suit thread.  'kept up' maintenance is probably an understatement!  ?

Now a little about the actual job.

• Valve Stem seal replacement is a labour-intensive job.  The parts are relatively inexpensive; a couple of boxes of seals, a bunch of gaskets.  The cost is in the labour.
• During disassembly the auxilliary water pump crumbled (love that 14 year old BMW plastic); it will likely happen on yours.  Around $400 here.
• Yes, this job is more often done in with the heads in-place. Saves additional cost of head gaskets, bolts, and all that fun.  Special tools are available to help with doing the job in-situ.  The shop I use hires in the tools when they're needed.  Cooling system out.  Cams removed, etc etc.
• Compressed air to hold the valve closed, to allow remove the collet, extract the seal, replace the seal etc.
• I understand the new valve stem seals are made from a different material.  Elring brand were used.  I think there's a 'revision' number indicated on the BMW Parts schedule - check it out on in the BMW parts catalogue.
• It's tight - space-wise - but do-able.  Patience required.
• Need to re-time the Valvetronic setup when the job is done; this is not a backyard job unless you have all the puter stuff.  
• It's quite the jigsaw puzzle to get the shooting match back together.
• I don't know how much it cost the insurers, I paid for the pump, insurance excess, and cost of Wurth intake cleaner and associated labour with the intake clean.  Phew, that's a relief.  I knew it'd be a good few grand plus GST, based on what I'd read on the US sites, labour cost, parts estimate, and a guestimate of renting the tools.
• It would have been around 3 days labour give or take, plus it was in the shop for a couple of weeks; I was in no hurry for the car so preferred they work on it when they wanted to.
• The old seals were totally flogged-out; your eye-ometer™ is all that's needed to see that.  No sealion is going to be happy with those baggy-old worn out items, and nor is your N62 V8!  After, all any sea lion wants is a good tight seal, right?  ?

Outcome:  Oil use is down.   Puffing Billy effect is gone.  Performance is improved. Fuel economy is better.  Perhaps the latter two are more attributable to the intake clean?  I'm sure vacuum loss wasn't helping things.  It hasn't helped dad-jokes in my posts, either! ?

I know there are better cars, newer cars, flasher cars.  As an allround package, I totally love driving my e60 545i.  I'll buy another MBI policy when this one expires.  I'm not ready to move this car on yet, and am about to do brakes at all corners, and tension struts at the front, so am planning on keeping it for a while.  I can't think of a car I'd rather drive for the purposes I use it for, on my wallet (forget fantasy garage or Lotto wins).  

If you're fussy on your maintenance like I am, a tough year could cost you $5k.  Perhaps this is one of those years for you; hopefully you'll find it less wallet-burning.  Whether it's worth doing your vehicle is a value judgement for you to make.  I agree with the earlier comment from @Gaz that you want to find a shop that's done it a few times before.  They'll know the ins and outs, and can price it accurately, and do the work efficiently.

Hopefully that was helpful.

I really must finish editing my movie on this job!  It'll make ya'll laugh.

Cheers

Olaf.

PS: I mentioned before that Patience is required.  Dunno if they were spinning Lloyd Cole in the workshop, but this could have been soothing, particularly toward the rear cylinders.  Not my favourite Lloyd Cole song; if you don't know it, you owe yourself to at least listen to the whole of Rattlesnakes.  One of the coolest albums of 1984.

 

[awake 1]

Update on the valve stem seals on the 550.  Job now done and the car is running sweet! After shopping around and getting estimates for the work, I selected SD European in Horotiu (just north of Hamilton) do the work.  The bill matched their estimate so no surprises and included replacing spark plugs plus all the other gaskets and seals etc.  Compared with BM Workshop in Botany I just saved myself $2,000!  Couldn't be happier with SD European and will definitely use them for all future work.  Great to deal with, friendly and helpful and competitively priced.  What more could you ask for?  Stoked!

[Eagle 1662]

Thinking outside your city pays off after all

[Spinner99 55]

I've recently done the valve stem seals on my E61 and must have looked at this thread at least ten times over the last year or so while deciding whether to send it somewhere or do it myself. There was a lot of umming and ahhing over the outlay of tools vs the cost for a garage to do the work.  In the end I went DIY so I thought I'd just put it out there for anyone else that's thinking about it, I got the job done for somewhere around the $1700 mark plus a week of my time, which is a big discount assuming you have the time to spare of course.

Parts were around $650, shipping and exchange rate dependent of course. I got my parts for this project from FCP.

On top of the valve stem seals that also included all the gaskets & o-rings etc for the valve covers, upper timing covers, spark plug tubes (I used Febi as they were much cheaper but I think I'd use BMW original next time), and spark plugs because it's so much easier to do them with the spark plug tubes out that I think every time you have the valve cover off you should change them. 

Tools ~$1k

I had a tool up a little.  Its a bit of an outlay but relative to the spend to get someone else to do it I thought it was worth it.  I already had an air compressor and decided to go the air method (vs rope method).   I ended up getting

• A N62 valve spring compression tool kit from Aus (not the AGA one)
• A really long (650mm I think) 1/2" drive ratchet to turn the engine over with - long enough it poked out the top of the engine bay.
• A cheap leak down tester to hold the air pressure in the cylinders.
• And I splashed out on some AGA Valve Stem Seal plyers

It's worth noting that Tony's AGA Tool Rental Service delivers worldwide now, but I don't know what the cost would be for rental + return shipping but may be worth a look into too.

 

In terms of difficulty, I agree with other peoples opinions  I've seen that if you can do the valve covers you can do the valve stem seals.  

And I guess the final test is - would I do it again if I had to? Yes I would, especially now I have the tools.  

Edited April 29, 2022 by Spinner99

[Spinner99 55]

One year on and I'm dragging this thread up again.  The car is running mint and I couldn't be happier that I did the valve stem seals last year. 

I've just done my annual oil change, the previous one was done just prior to the VSS job.  I clocked up 4000k in the year prior to doing the VSS's and off the top of my head I think I had to put somewhere in the 750ml-1000ml range of oil in to keep it topped up over that year. Unfortunately I didn't keep records of those top ups and I'm regretting that now, but I did regularly see the oil level on the i-drive sitting below full.

This year I've done 3800km in the car, and I've put exactly 0ml of oil in over that time.  It's always been sitting on full on the idrive oil level indicator right to to today when I did the oil change.

At my previous warrant it barely passed with comments about the smoke,  I think the inspector possibly felt sorry for me.  This year, not a mention of any smoke!

I'm super stoked there's no more oil consumption, and  I no longer have a feeling of dread when the lights turn red and I sit there idling, no more thinking "how big will the cloud behind me be?