Doug DeMuro on M Cars getting rarer and more expensive

[Gabe79 410]

It's a good watch, in that Doug-sort-of-way.

[pldubs 308]

He's probably right about price

 

but e39 possibly the best looking sedan ever ? ?‍♂️?‍♂️?‍♂️

[Michael. 2313]

I think all the 5 series since the E39 have got worse.

E60 was ok, bit weird but it's not too bad, interior lets them down more than anything. Personally not a fan of the noise the V10 made over the previous S62 V8 but that's just me, an engine in such a car should soothe your ear rather than attack it like bees. Then theres the debate of the diff thumping SMG they had...  

All the new ones, whatever the chassis codes, are just massive 7 series with dozens of M5 badges, and run click button automatic manual gearbox. Yes they might be hugely fast and full of fancy computers... but why is that good, especially when it comes to age and longevity, or the simplicity of fun? 

I think true enthusiasts can see the purity of the E39 M5 as the last great M car, Doug got it right, it's just the right blend of old and new. Classy styling, not over the top, real manual gearbox, tried and proven technology. Plus, 400hp and 500nm is plenty, and it's an amount you can use in the real world. 

It's also worth remembering the E39 is basically the same size as a new M3. It's all gone wrong in the new era!

Edited September 7, 2017 by Michael.

[Driftit 2078]

Manual E60 over all the other M5's for me.

[Gabe79 410]

23 minutes ago, Driftit said:

Manual E60 over all the other M5's for me.

You're weird.

[GorGasm 563]

Send me over a manual conversion plz

In all fairness, the E60 SMG is actually pretty good when you are getting on it.  The F10 5 series was a bit of a mis-step.  It's a great car, looks great, great interior and build but it's essentially a 7 series.  The latest M5 is heading back in the right direction, with weight loss etc.

[Driftit 2078]

2 hours ago, GorGasm said:

Send me over a manual conversion plz

In all fairness, the E60 SMG is actually pretty good when you are getting on it.  The F10 5 series was a bit of a mis-step.  It's a great car, looks great, great interior and build but it's essentially a 7 series.  The latest M5 is heading back in the right direction, with weight loss etc.

Just say when Logan.  I can seriously find you a conversion.

[GorGasm 563]

It would be sick, but every cent I spent on it could be spent on my next car.

[Michael. 2313]

10 hours ago, GorGasm said:

 The latest M5 is heading back in the right direction, with weight loss etc.

2017 M5 weight is quoted at 1855kg without driver

Still heavy, but not too bad considering the size / spec of the car.

E39 M5 was 1750kg 

[m325i 709]

Doug the type of .... ah never mind...

NZ M3s suffer from the same fate. Pretty rare to see a stock one now. 

 

Edited September 11, 2017 by m325i

[Gabe79 410]

Just now, 3pedals said:

Some self appointed dross jock makes some noise on a populist social media platform - are we supposed to take note ?? no thanks 

 More mindless sh*t with no research just a vacuous moron sounding off but then he has probably been stealing cues from  their president ?? 

Don't have to like the guy, but that's a pretty uncharitable comparison. ?

His points are reasonably valid and do seem to echo reality in that, at least to me, the e39 m5 in particular is the pinnacle of BMW cars. Call it confirmation bias on my part. 

[Michael. 2313]

5 hours ago, 3pedals said:

Some self appointed dross jock makes some noise on a populist social media platform - are we supposed to take note ?? no thanks 

 More mindless sh*t with no research just a vacuous moron sounding off but then he has probably been stealing cues from  their president ?? 

Rather listen to his opinions than yours!  

[Palazzo 477]

It's strange, when he criticised BMWs a few weeks back, all he wrote was uninformed click bait.

[Golfboy666GTI 68]

On 9/8/2017 at 10:50 AM, Driftit said:

Manual E60 over all the other M5's for me.

Is the factory manual E60 gearbox just the same out of the E39? From what I have read the V8 ratios don't suit the V10?

 

[Olaf 3317]

On 9/7/2017 at 3:40 PM, Michael. said:

I think all the 5 series since the E39 have got worse.

E60 was ok, bit weird but it's not too bad, interior lets them down more than anything.

please explain!  lets them down how? Aesthetics?  Function?  Durability?

[Olaf 3317]

I got to 2:59 and couldn't listen to any more of this guy.  I'm sure he has an opinion and a conclusion; if you can endure 15 mins of that presentation you're probably on some kind of medication, or quite possibly should check and confirm you still have a pulse.

[Driftit 2078]

He is pretty well known for his sh*t click bait.

[m325i 709]

Some of his videos showing the quirks of quirky cars are pretty good. 

Also the one slaying the Maserati makes me pitty everyone I see driving one. 

[Michael. 2313]

13 hours ago, Olaf said:

please explain!  lets them down how? Aesthetics?  Function?  Durability?

Interior, Idrive was a step backwards far too complicated, now it's dated and annoying to use. The dash board center console is exceptionally boring, has no flow into the lower console, and the  design and the door cards as they droop down doesn't add to a positive ambiance, they give off a rather depressing vibe. The E39 interior is such a nicer place to be, it's like it was designed by people that cared about what they were doing, E60 more so a quick coffee break design. 

[hqstu 780]

It will be interesting to see how these cars appreciate in different markets, Europe, US, NZ/AUS, LHD, RHD...

[BreakMyWindow 1874]

Had to get mine valued again for insurance today. Same value as it was 2 years ago and with 20,000kms less. 

[hotwire 352]

1 hour ago, Michael. said:

Interior, Idrive was a step backwards far too complicated, now it's dated and annoying to use. The dash board center console is exceptionally boring, has no flow into the lower console, and the  design and the door cards as they droop down doesn't add to a positive ambiance, they give off a rather depressing vibe. The E39 interior is such a nicer place to be, it's like it was designed by people that cared about what they were doing, E60 more so a quick coffee break design. 

Agree with you on this one Michael. Without any bias too...

[Neal 544]

So when's the standard E46 M3s going up in price ?  Prices tanked in the last couple of yeas. E30 M325i money ?

[Olaf 3317]

9 hours ago, Michael. said:

Interior, Idrive was a step backwards far too complicated, now it's dated and annoying to use. The dash board center console is exceptionally boring, has no flow into the lower console, and the  design and the door cards as they droop down doesn't add to a positive ambiance, they give off a rather depressing vibe. The E39 interior is such a nicer place to be, it's like it was designed by people that cared about what they were doing, E60 more so a quick coffee break design. 

interesting!  I'm largely un-moved by iDrive, and find it a bit of a faff in use.  On the move, iDrive is a bit sh*t really.  Even changing sources on the stereo is four to five presses compared with on the e46. Still, it does (or rather, can) convey a great deal of info.  Thankfully main A/C/ventillation controls are separate and analogue!  In fact, these are more successful in the e60 than the e46/e39.  

Additionally, the custom assignment of buttons on the steering wheel via iDrive in the e60 is a genuine useabiity step forward.  For example my diamond button is set to 'recirc' - as I approach a tunnel of follow a diesel truck I now keep my hands on the wheel to close off fresh air.  The same is true for restoring fresh air.

In terms of safety, the e60 features the same forward steps from e46/e39 as the e90, e87 etc... meeting 5 stars and significantly surpassing e46/e39 in terms of front seat leg/knee intrusion in frontal impact.  The structure is designed to stay away from your knees and legs, and they've used the elevated and strong visual horizontal bar design cues to give you something to focus on, whilst cunningly returning away from the front seat passengers above the central horizontal plane.  I used to prefer the e39/e46 also.  This more contemporary design language makes the older models look far more dated. 

I do agree about the e60 centre console and the new way of 'not particularly integrating with the dashboard'.  Defying convention, really.  And good on them for being bold.  What annoys me is the vast area of useless space. And the centre console door is bloody annoying to use on the move.

Lighting controls are improved on the e60, as are wiper controls.  Having cruise control on its own stalk, and in a consistent location on the e60 is a big step forward for the e60, de-cluttering the steering wheel controls simplifying the interface.  Relocating the central locking and hazard controls to the top-centre of the dashboard is genius; on the e46 they were an afterthought thrown somewhere in the centre console, lost, and unintuitive to find.

And although the indicator stalk and it's funtion is initially confusing in the e60 (as per the e87 and I think the e90), it's excellent in use once you know it.  I'm sure it took engineering students years starting with a blank sheet with the brief to "build a better indicator stalk function".  I'd love to see the other prototypes.

There ya go, one man's meat is another man's poison. 

[Olaf 3317]

6 hours ago, Neal said:

So when's the standard E46 M3s going up in price ?  Prices tanked in the last couple of yeas. E30 M325i money ?

I know I really should be buying one now...