Anthony M3 22 Report post Posted December 20, 2015 Anyone know of someone who sells this in Auckland had a look around but can't find anywhere that Sells the TWS. Seen you can get it online but prefer local. Cheers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted December 20, 2015 Any BMW dealer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gjm 3258 Report post Posted December 20, 2015 (edited) BMW TSB SI B11 08 98 regarding engine oil for M engines calls for "Castrol RS SAE 10W-60 Synthetic Oil also called Castrol TWS Motorsport SAE 10W-60 Synthetic Oil".Castrol RS is the pre-2000 formulation. After 2000, Castrol RS product was reformulated and lost its BMW approval.According to Castrol, EDGE 10w-60 is the same as TWS.The pre-2000 RS formula, Castrol TWS Motorsport SAE 10W-60 Synthetic Oil, and Castrol Edge 10w-60 have a higher film strength than other Castrol 10w-60 oils. The BMW Approved product is ester-based and a direct competitor to ELF and Motul ester racing oils, while the non-approved formulations are PAO based. You can normally buy Castrol EDGE 10w-60 at Supercheap. Edit: Or go to a BMW dealership, as Glenn suggests. Edited December 20, 2015 by gjm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tristan 338 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Castrol Edge 10w60 and TWS 10w60 are different oils. Other Castrol oils have lead to bearing issues in the M engines. I'd be inclined to get the correct oil from BMW (the only place that sells TWS) and not risk your engine. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BreakMyWindow 1874 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Edge 10w 60SN from reppers or supercheap is pretty much the same thing http://bimmersport.co.nz/topic/47977-bmw-m-approved-castrol-edge-tws-10w-60-vs/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3_Power 636 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) Non of the current crop of TWS is the same as the original formulated for the M engine. That stuff is long gone. Just use the new Shell product that BMW is now selling for all their Turbo engines. It's the same stuff Ferrari uses for all their high revving engines. It's a better product than Castrol anyways. Edited December 22, 2015 by M3_Power Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
*Glenn* 854 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 What is the Shell product code for that oil Tom ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andrewm 236 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Shell helix ultra racing 10w-60 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Navin 180 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Castrol Edge 10w60 and TWS 10w60 are different oils. Other Castrol oils have lead to bearing issues in the M engines. I'd be inclined to get the correct oil from BMW (the only place that sells TWS) and not risk your engine. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk You can get TWS from Repco or any Castrol dealer, it just needs to be ordered in so best to ring prior Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MISS BM 712 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 BMW dealer. Did an oil test with both the stuff off the Repco shelf and the stuff from the dealer, very different. BMW have now partner up with shell, but I wouldn't recommend changing unless you've tested both oils as the same... Why risk anything? Jerry Clayton sell it Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3AN 4016 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Did an oil test with both the stuff off the Repco shelf and the stuff from the dealer, very different. Please share the results, they'll be devoured by the internet. Castrol themselves say SN EDGE is equivalent to TWS. Most (myself included) do not believe they make TWS with unicorn blood. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MISS BM 712 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Please share the results, they'll be devoured by the internet. Castrol themselves say SN EDGE is equivalent to TWS. Most (myself included) do not believe they make TWS with unicorn blood. Colour and make up completely different. Got a bottle of both and chucked each in a cup. TWS noticeably green in colour vs a honey colour in the standard SN. Might also add those who I personally know that have used SN have had rods go and other issues. I'd stay clear.. For the sake of $10-$20 difference between the two, why the hell would anyone bother risking it? Keen to send away to lab and test both out scientifically.. But may be seen as taking it to far.. Hmm 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3AN 4016 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Keen to send away to lab and test both out scientifically.. But may be seen as taking it to far.. Hmm I reckon just do it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3AN 4016 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) For the sake of $10-$20 difference between the two, why the hell would anyone bother risking it? TBH the difference can be as much as $50 for 5 litres, nobody should pay retail for off the shelf oil. And the reason why, well the oil manufacturer says it's just dandy... and that's a pretty good reason. I'm not saying your decision is wrong, just that there's a justification for a different decision. Many S54's have gone 'bang' using only TWS also. Edited December 22, 2015 by M3AN Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MISS BM 712 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Well given I'm getting it the same price as Repco, I'll never complain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tristan 338 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Many S54's have gone 'bang' using only TWS also. Would love to see your source for this. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hybrid 1043 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 In real world terms - I don't think generally it has anything to really do with the oil you put in your car, its more to do with how its driven (cold startup etc) and neglect as to why bearings fail. The 'going bang' issue was more a oil starvation issue with the reversed sump and oil pickup design under hard braking and transition to cornering. The S engines have tighter tolerances than normal but most oil that OEMs choose is more based on stability under longer service intervals than out right performance under extreme conditions. 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gjm 3258 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Keen to send away to lab and test both out scientifically.. But may be seen as taking it to far.. Hmm Any idea of the cost associated with the testing? I reiterated what I was told by a Castrol Racing rep when I said they're the same, but that doesn't mean he wasn't wrong! I recall years ago people saying how superior ATE Blue brake fluid was when compared to the 'normal' Gold. These genuinely are identical fluids: ATE used a different colour to speed when the user could identify new fluid in a fluid change. Of course, that reasoning doesn't apply with engine oil! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rubix 434 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Might also add those who I personally know that have used SN have had rods go and other issues. I'd stay clear.. nearing 500,000km and car has only ever been run on 10w-60 SN.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hybrid 1043 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Have run it on several cars for the past 10 years ... no issues ever. Infact Jamez ran it for 4 years in his race car that only ever saw extreme conditions, engine started with 80,000ks on it ... and was compeditive and still had all factory hoan marks when he dismantelled it for a routine rebuild. This meant that he didnt actually need to rebuild it. I wouldnt believe everything youre told on the internet or around some traps. I prefer to rely on proven race performance. At the end of the day as long as you select a good mid range oil which is matched to you temprature condition of where you live (again a non issue in New Zealands mild temprature range) and you maintain oil change schedules you car will last you 300-500ks easy. I would be more worried about cam lobe wear than bearing failure in this case. I think Polly summed it up once in a thread, buy some bloody oil, change the filter, do an oil change, close the bonnet and just go enjoy your car. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kiwi328i 118 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 "I think Polly summed it up once in a thread, buy some bloody oil, change the filter, do an oil change, close the bonnet and just go enjoy your car." Yep, thats what I do. I own a car that is 22 years old. The oil I put in it now has a level of technology that is well past the level of technology BMW had in it's original design. I buy some 'decent' oil, not the best, and well past the worse, it's either Castrol or something, it's synthetic and it gets changed regularly with an oil filter every second one. If I had an M3 or M5 or something, I would just buy the best whatever, that's a different level altogether. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jamez 2147483647 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Have run it on several cars for the past 10 years ... no issues ever. Infact Jamez ran it for 4 years in his race car that only ever saw extreme conditions, engine started with 80,000ks on it ... and was compeditive and still had all factory hoan marks when he dismantelled it for a routine rebuild. This meant that he didnt actually need to rebuild it. I wouldnt believe everything youre told on the internet or around some traps. I prefer to rely on proven race performance. At the end of the day as long as you select a good mid range oil which is matched to you temprature condition of where you live (again a non issue in New Zealands mild temprature range) and you maintain oil change schedules you car will last you 300-500ks easy. I would be more worried about cam lobe wear than bearing failure in this case. I think Polly summed it up once in a thread, buy some bloody oil, change the filter, do an oil change, close the bonnet and just go enjoy your car. I can also confirm that I found the following: -Running the car super lean will cause the pistons to blow up almost straight away from detonation. -Having an oil line burst gives you about 300 meters of road before the bearings fall out. -When the bearings go, the pistons will tap the head, It only took the layer of carbon off so didn't do any damage. -Running 5w40 Edge has dropped running temps considerably at the track, not only that but its also much cheaper. Seems like a no brainier. I would say that as long as the engine is run at the correct temps, with the correct AFR and with a constant oil supply, they are pretty bullet proof motors. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M3_Power 636 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Rod bearing issue on the s54 motor was never caused by oil, it was always a manufacturing tolerance issue and oil pump issue. Oil is oil ... If it is the right working range then it'll be fine. Big end bearings are a maintenance item anyway. Like Josh said, I'd be more worried about cams and cam followers snd I might add headgasket. Those seem to fail at a much much higher rate than big end bearings, especially if driven hard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
m325i 709 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 ^Have you done bearings Tom? At what Kms would you recommend it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BreakMyWindow 1874 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) I reckon first owners not paying attention to the warm up lights in their s54's and S62's has contributed largely to the premature engine failures. Tom posted the dets that I linked in previous post about the differences between TWS and SN... sweet f all. I've been running SN in both my M5's. And have done over 35,000kms with it. I let the warm up lights go out, and wait for the oil temp to get to around 78 deg C before getting enthusiastic. No issues. Edited December 22, 2015 by BreakMyWindow Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
