Quite possibly the coolest X5 on the north island...

[Olaf 3341]

https://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/bmw/auction-1512806063.htm?rsqid=31059e065698405daad1fb6f7d035165 

@_ethrty-Andy_  some ideas for yours in there?  camo, nudge bar, and black tiger claws.  Though, surprisingly, still looking a bit MILD.

[Eagle 1679]

Broken chain guides are cool?   

[Olaf 3341]

UPDATE:  yes, I was wrong.  because that cool one that we saw on here a few months back, is now FOR SALE!

 

https://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/bmw/auction-1437664883.htm?rsqid=0d8fdbbf5cda4842984cf45c25cb43ac

 

Edited January 20, 2018 by Olaf

[Olaf 3341]

2 hours ago, Eagle said:

Broken chain guides are cool?   

does the first one feature broken chain guides?  Or are you talking about the M62 in general?

[Eagle 1679]

I hope it doesn't its in the danger zone where the TU failure seems to appear(200k-250k). Would hope its had at least the tensioner replaced early on.   

[TermiPeteNZ 1319]

16 hours ago, Eagle said:

I hope it doesn't its in the danger zone where the TU failure seems to appear(200k-250k). Would hope its had at least the tensioner replaced early on.   

My X5 is in that range (228KM) but has MBI through until 250kms

Difficult to know whether to proactively sort now or do it before the MBI expires ….. :\

[NZ BMW 368]

38 minutes ago, TermiPeteNZ said:

My X5 is in that range (228KM) but has MBI through until 250kms

Difficult to know whether to proactively sort now or do it before the MBI expires ….. :\

I was thinking the other day, I should really change all the oil in my diff and transfer case etc. however, my MBI actually incentivises me to NOT do this. There’s not requirement and the excess is not that much greater than the cost of service. 

[NZ BMW 368]

2 hours ago, 3pedals said:

Really !!!  What sort of arse about face logic is this - you will happily drive a vehicle in a substandard condition because your insurance will pay for the damage?

Do the gearbox, transfer and diff oils and be stunned at the difference in how your X5 drives - the lubricants are long life not Life long and they break down. 

I didn’t say that at all, it incentivises me not to, I will still do it because like you I tend to do a bit extra, in fact I did the transmission at 80,000kms. 

The logic is perfectly reasonable - I tend to keep my cars for 3-4 years always under warranty and generally from 70/80-100/120kms.

If your insurance largely removes the risk of the cost of potential failure why would a person responding to incentives spend any money above what is required to satisfy their insurance requirements? 

You might find that personally offensive to your sensibilities but that’s how a lot of people think. When I trade or sell the car I doubt I’ll be able to recoup any of that additional cost either. 

The numbers don’t make sense for people to maintain their vehicles to that level so hardly anyone does. 

[Olaf 3341]

On 1/22/2018 at 8:26 AM, NZ BMW said:

I was thinking the other day, I should really change all the oil in my diff and transfer case etc. however, my MBI actually incentivises me to NOT do this. There’s not requirement and the excess is not that much greater than the cost of service. 

I'd like to read the clauses that 'incentivise you not to' change your fluids 'in diff and transfer case etc' in your MBI.  Which policy do you have?

I know the MBI I have seeks to ensure the vehicle is regularly maintained.  Which mine is.  

 

[coop 261]

3 hours ago, 3pedals said:

Thats sort of thinking is why there are so  many shitters on our roads now with cheap tyres and fukt engines, transmissions and suspension - time bombs for the next owner.

The numbers are all in how you choose to construct and apply  them - you can choose to see your car as a liability, I choose to see mine as a source of value - I value it performing well and safely so I maintain it well, keep it longer, but more relevant to your proposition:

Running a car for 2-3 years or 20- 40,000km then turning it over is the higher cost option as you take a big depreciation hit and don't benefit from the maintenace.  

Over a 5 -7 year period the maintenace cost is lower than the depreciation so you  actually come out significantly ahead- I am currently sitting about 18 grand up on the X5  after 5 years and thats based on cash not financed. 

This has to be taken on a case by case basis though?

Buy a new ute or smaller SUV for $60k. No money spent on repairs for warranty period, say five years, sell after five years and 100-120,000km for 30-35k.

Buy a new VW Golf or Camry for $30k. Same as above, but sell for about $15k after five years.

No money spent on repairs, no dramas with DIY R&M (or paying someone $80+/hr), no worries before a long trip, organising repairs etc.  The Golf/Camry has cost less than $100/week to own. The ute/SUV maybe $120. Rough figures but a general idea and a reason why a lot of people buy new and take a hit in depreciation instead of chasing their tail repairing and maintaining something older. 

 

Unfortunately for most motorists there is simply no incentive to proactively keep on top of R&M for a 10+ year old/150,000+ car. The cost to do so outweighs the hit in resale after say 5 years of owner ship especially on something like an X5 etc.  

 

 

 

Edited January 23, 2018 by coop

[NZ BMW 368]

5 hours ago, Olaf said:

I'd like to read the clauses that 'incentivise you not to' change your fluids 'in diff and transfer case etc' in your MBI.  Which policy do you have?

I know the MBI I have seeks to ensure the vehicle is regularly maintained.  Which mine is.  

 

The requirements are that you service the engine every 10,000km and the transmission every 30,000km and carry out recommended work. So if your mechanic writes on your invoice that you should change the diff fluid then you have to in order to maintain your insurance. 

Therefore the incentive is to not do that. Neither is there anything in there about changing the coolant at the recommended interval. Although of your mechanic is worth his salt they should at least test the condition of that during each service and recommend replacement. 

[Olaf 3341]

5 minutes ago, NZ BMW said:

The requirements are that you service the engine every 10,000km and the transmission every 30,000km and carry out recommended work. So if your mechanic writes on your invoice that you should change the diff fluid then you have to in order to maintain your insurance. 

Therefore the incentive is to not do that. Neither is there anything in there about changing the coolant at the recommended interval. Although of your mechanic is worth his salt they should at least test the condition of that during each service and recommend replacement. 

You clearly have a different MBI to mine**.  Under my policy, leaving diff fluids and auto trans fluids when they're in need of replacement are covered under the second and seventh bullet points below.  That is, in the event I haven't had those items checked for level and condition - and have that detailed in the invoice - I have little to rely upon for a future claim, and am likely to be declined.

I think you're being a little disingenuous is suggesting there is "incentive *not* to do that".   You'd need clauses along the lines of "thou shalt not service your vehicle outside of basic annual or 10,000km servicing; if you do so without checking with us first your cover will be voided" to really suggest there's an active disincentive.  

There's a clear incentive to maintain your vehicle; the avoidance of unplanned downtime and associated costs, and minimising wear on other systems.  Your justification for not doing so will be based more on your personal values, than interpretation of drafting in a policy preventing you from doing so!

** here's the basics on servicing from my MBI:

 

the vehicle must be kept serviced to ensure the cover remains in place. 

 

It says you 'may have your vehicle serviced at any recognised service facility'.

 

Petrol-powered vehicles every 15,000kms or 12 months.

 

"The following must be checked and attended to as required:

• Change Engine Oil and Oil Filter;
• All Fluid Levels and Conditions;
• Air Filter;
• All Belts.  Replace as necessary.  Please note cambelts must be replacedas specified by the vehicle manufacturer;
• Cooling System including inhibitor and hoses;
• Turbo Oil Feed;
• Automatic Transmission;
• Braking System including Brake Fluid Condition
• Air Conditioning
• Steering and Suspension systems.

Once a service is completed, you must make sure your service facility completes and checks the service check history at the time of service.

This information will be required in the event of a claim.  Please retain all of these invoices for future reference,"

[NZ BMW 368]

8 hours ago, 3pedals said:

Thats sort of thinking is why there are so  many shitters on our roads now with cheap tyres and fukt engines, transmissions and suspension - time bombs for the next owner.

The numbers are all in how you choose to construct and apply  them - you can choose to see your car as a liability, I choose to see mine as a source of value - I value it performing well and safely so I maintain it well, keep it longer, but more relevant to your proposition:

Running a car for 2-3 years or 20- 40,000km then turning it over is the higher cost option as you take a big depreciation hit and don't benefit from the maintenace.  

Over a 5 -7 year period the maintenace cost is lower than the depreciation so you  actually come out significantly ahead- I am currently sitting about 18 grand up on the X5  after 5 years and thats based on cash not financed. 

You’re right, once the depreciation flattens out, you’re ahead. 

Personally I have no interest in holding a car much longer than 4 or maybe 5 years max so it’s a choice to turn them over. 

I wonder if there is an inflection point? For example if you keep a car for 30 years do you reach a point where you start to loose again.

Personally I see cars as a liability to be minimised, within reason. I can hand on heart say I’ve never traded or sold a car with tyres, brakes etc that I wouldn’t be happy to drive on, or which wasn’t serviced well.  

But if I know I’m going to get rid of my BMW at circa 100ks I’m not going to rebuild the cooling system if I don’t have to, why would I? No one will pay me extra for it and most people buying it won’t value (pay me) it. 

Edited January 23, 2018 by NZ BMW

[M3AN 4016]

Paint me a sceptic.

I don't believe there's any way you can come out ahead (economically speaking) buying a brand new vehicle. Unless you're particularly unlucky you could never spend the equivalent of depreciation on maintenance.

Isn't the rule of thumb - 10% as soon as you drive it off the lot, 15% once you've hit 1,000 km's and 20% in the first year? And apparently 50% after 4 years (https://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/news/89145417/new-zealand-has-highest-car-depreciation-rate-in-the-world-says-study).

By the time depreciation slows to a reasonable level the warranty has expired and you're paying for maintenance anyway.

Maybe I misunderstood some of the previous posts?

[kwhelan 241]

11 hours ago, 3pedals said:

Depreciation is about 26% / annum so if you buy a 2-3 year old car with 50,000km on it for $50,000 the biggest drops have occurred over the next 3 years it will drop to $20,000 or so in value or a about $10 grand a year- thats pretty hard to spend in maintenance. 

 If you do the suspension/ gearbox/ waterpump etc at the end of the first year for say  $10 grand  as preventative maintenance then you get 2 years return on that investment and you are still $20 grand up - if you then sell the car and chuck in another $30 grand to get another 50 k car you again do another $30 grand BUT  if you keep the car for another 2 years and spend $5 grand on some more stuff you save a further $7 grand so all up after 5 years you can be $27 grand up. 

BUT best of all you get to drive an as new functioning car for the full period 

depreciation is very model independent and I would suggest If I had bought a new car and at 50,000km it needed 10k of maintainance I Would say I was had. Why on earth should you be doing suspension/gearbox/waterpump at year 3-4. Any one in their right mind would call that a lemon.

Every dealer practically now has 5yrs or 100k warranty and thats because they don't expect there to be any issues that will cost them.

Show me a japanese car that needs 10k of mainataince at 50,000 and I would say it was a dud and an exception. You could own any number of cars for 3 yrs do no maintainance except the required for warranty oil/fluids/tyres and sell it in basically brand new condition at 3 yrs old, less depreciation of course

The only cars that are worth 50k at year 3 started off at some exorbitant  high price( mostly euro).I get that a percentage hits a higher price more so the losses are greater but anyone who buys new is just burning money in my opinion.

Any walk around Geoff Gray or mercedes dealer shows you The smart buys are the 12month tradeins or ex dealer models with 10k on the clock

 

[Blackie 510]

Never spent 10k on repairs in my life lol. You must have deep pockets!

[NZ BMW 368]

On 1/23/2018 at 6:49 PM, Olaf said:

You clearly have a different MBI to mine**.  Under my policy, leaving diff fluids and auto trans fluids when they're in need of replacement are covered under the second and seventh bullet points below.  That is, in the event I haven't had those items checked for level and condition - and have that detailed in the invoice - I have little to rely upon for a future claim, and am likely to be declined.

I think you're being a little disingenuous is suggesting there is "incentive *not* to do that".   You'd need clauses along the lines of "thou shalt not service your vehicle outside of basic annual or 10,000km servicing; if you do so without checking with us first your cover will be voided" to really suggest there's an active disincentive.  

There's a clear incentive to maintain your vehicle; the avoidance of unplanned downtime and associated costs, and minimising wear on other systems.  Your justification for not doing so will be based more on your personal values, than interpretation of drafting in a policy preventing you from doing so!

** here's the basics on servicing from my MBI:

 

the vehicle must be kept serviced to ensure the cover remains in place. 

 

It says you 'may have your vehicle serviced at any recognised service facility'.

 

Petrol-powered vehicles every 15,000kms or 12 months.

 

"The following must be checked and attended to as required:

• Change Engine Oil and Oil Filter;
• All Fluid Levels and Conditions;
• Air Filter;
• All Belts.  Replace as necessary.  Please note cambelts must be replacedas specified by the vehicle manufacturer;
• Cooling System including inhibitor and hoses;
• Turbo Oil Feed;
• Automatic Transmission;
• Braking System including Brake Fluid Condition
• Air Conditioning
• Steering and Suspension systems.

Once a service is completed, you must make sure your service facility completes and checks the service check history at the time of service.

This information will be required in the event of a claim.  Please retain all of these invoices for future reference,"

How do you propose one checks the diff and transmission fluid on these cars at each service? I assume you can maybe get a level read out of the diagnostic computer but don’t they just have a drain plug and that’s it? 

I suspect what most are places do is a visual inspection of the underside of the car and if there are no obvious leaks it must be ok and is signed off. 

[B.M.W Ltd 950]

They have level plugs