No more BMW V12s after this year

[gjm 3258]

On  Tuesday January 18th BMW announced it will cease building V-12 engines, for BMWs, in June this year. Rolls-Royce also uses BMW V-12s, and production of those engines will continue.

BMW have offered a V12 since 1987 and the E32, and there will be a special 'Final V12' version of the 7-Series M760i xDrive, which will be offered with first refusal to customers who have previously bought new V12 7-series cars. There will be very, very few options on this car - it will simply come with everything as standard. You can choose paint colour, leather options, and whether you'd like grey or black wheels...

The engine is the same as that in the current M760i xDrive: 6.6-litre twin-turbo V12, 600 hp and 627 lb-ft of torque. The M70B50 in the 1987 E32 7-series produced about half of that.

As the V12 will be gone, the most powerful new 7-series is likely to be the i7.

Mercedes-Benz are likely to offer an ICE V12 until 2030 when they go fully electric; Audi has already dropped the W12, and the rest of the VAG group is likely to do the same by the end of 2026.

[Michael. 2313]

RIP. Oh well plenty of used v12 engines around to shove in a smaller cars hehe 

[E30 325i Rag-Top 2963]

19 hours ago, gjm said:

On  Tuesday January 18th BMW announced it will cease building V-12 engines, for BMWs, in June this year. Rolls-Royce also uses BMW V-12s, and production of those engines will continue.

The first of many ICE engines to be cut from the range, with the next level of Euro 6 (e?) emissions coming into effect it’s impossible to get the performance engines to comply.

Combined with fleet average CO2 targets in most OECD countries they don’t stack up any more.

19 hours ago, Michael. said:

Oh well plenty of used v12 engines around to shove in a smaller cars hehe 

The M760Li engine is crammed into the engine bay on a G12 7er, it would be a TARDIS like effort to get it into anything smaller. I’m not sure it would be worth all the effort tbh, unless it’s a kit-car / replica of something V12 and you need that sound a boosted 6 or V8 would probably give better output and weight balance?

[Michael. 2313]

40 minutes ago, E30 325i Rag-Top said:

 

The M760Li engine is crammed into the engine bay on a G12 7er, it would be a TARDIS like effort to get it into anything smaller. I’m not sure it would be worth all the effort tbh, unless it’s a kit-car / replica of something V12 and you need that sound a boosted 6 or V8 would probably give better output and weight balance?

I was more thinking of an M73 or something old and simple. These modern engines likely will not be used for many conversions, too much going on - but who knows. 

That said I don't really like V12s that much, I think they are just fun with the number of cylinders and smooth 60 degree power strokes. Arguably your best with a I6 turbo or V8 of somekind, as a retrofit. Depends on goals or intention though. I agree about weight balance... on youtube theres a guy with a Toyota V12 being shoved into an MX5 which just strikes me as idiotic, with accessories its nearly a 300kg engine haha. Probably end up with a 65/35 weight split in a car that was about being balanced.... 

[Young Thrash Driver 1020]

It comes down to looking after the environment, no surprises then that they are dropping the oil dripping coolant swallowing seal munching V12s.

[gjm 3258]

3 hours ago, Young Thrash Driver said:

It comes down to looking after the environment, no surprises then that they are dropping the oil dripping coolant swallowing seal penguin munching V12s.

FTFY.

[coop 261]

7 hours ago, Young Thrash Driver said:

It comes down to looking after the environment, no surprises then that they are dropping the oil dripping coolant swallowing seal munching V12s.

 

If that is the reason for dropping it then BMW may as well drop all of their ICE engines 😉

[Michael. 2313]

9 hours ago, Young Thrash Driver said:

It comes down to looking after the environment, no surprises then that they are dropping the oil dripping coolant swallowing seal munching V12s.

Instead they make will make blow torches haha (i3 incident)

I wonder if any studies have been done to examine the co2 output of a singular fire from the specifications this runaway fire would produce. 

[E30 325i Rag-Top 2963]

I know you’ve got a thing against EVs, but the really funny part around that post is the fact the fire had nothing to do with the electrical elements of the car. How many petrol or diesel vehicles catch fire compared to EVs? Even as a percentage? How many petrol tankers or petrol stations catch fire compared to EV chargers?

Moral of the story from the post above - if you pay peanuts for servicing  you get monkeys working on your car, and this is what can happen.

In general Don’t believe any scaremongering, do some research and make an informed decision.

[Kiwi_BMW 89]

4 hours ago, E30 325i Rag-Top said:

I know you’ve got a thing against EVs, but the really funny part around that post is the fact the fire had nothing to do with the electrical elements of the car. How many petrol or diesel vehicles catch fire compared to EVs? Even as a percentage? How many petrol tankers or petrol stations catch fire compared to EV chargers?

Moral of the story from the post above - if you pay peanuts for servicing  you get monkeys working on your car, and this is what can happen.

In general Don’t believe any scaremongering, do some research and make an informed decision.

So what caused the fire?

What I got out of Michaels post is the emissions from the i3 fire, has anyone carried out a study to find out the emissions emitted by an EV going up in flames?

Everything I've heard from those that have watched an EV fire is it's over pretty dam quick and once the battery ignites it becomes a chemical fire and isn't easy to put out, chemical fires don't need oxygen to burn.

[Michael. 2313]

6 hours ago, E30 325i Rag-Top said:

I know you’ve got a thing against EVs, but the really funny part around that post is the fact the fire had nothing to do with the electrical elements of the car. How many petrol or diesel vehicles catch fire compared to EVs? Even as a percentage? How many petrol tankers or petrol stations catch fire compared to EV chargers?

Moral of the story from the post above - if you pay peanuts for servicing  you get monkeys working on your car, and this is what can happen.

In general Don’t believe any scaremongering, do some research and make an informed decision.

It still caught on fire and released toxic fumes. A study should be done on that.

I'm happy to be bias to petrol cars vs electric cars, just how god made me  

[BreakMyWindow 1878]

2 hours ago, Michael. said:

It still caught on fire and released toxic fumes. A study should be done on that.

I'm happy to be bias to petrol cars vs electric cars, just how god made me  

We pray for you. You’ll be ok ❤️

[E30 325i Rag-Top 2963]

3 hours ago, Kiwi_BMW said:

So what caused the fire?

Hot oil leaking onto an exhaust.

3 hours ago, Kiwi_BMW said:

chemical fires don't need oxygen to burn.

Not sure about that, I was always told all fires need three things: fuel, ignition and oxygen. 
The latest hi-tech equipment that’s being deployed to fight the anti-christ that is the EV fire… the good old fashioned fire blanket! Great big car sized ones. Cuts off the oxygen.

[aja540i 1906]

13 minutes ago, E30 325i Rag-Top said:

Hot oil leaking onto an exhaust.

Not sure about that, I was always told all fires need three things: fuel, ignition and oxygen. 
The latest hi-tech equipment that’s being deployed to fight the anti-christ that is the EV fire… the good old fashioned fire blanket! Great big car sized ones. Cuts off the oxygen.

Yeah, in certain situations a chemical fire will release its own oxygen and become self sustaining, not sure if that is the case with a lithium battery fire though...

[polley 916]

23 minutes ago, E30 325i Rag-Top said:

Hot oil leaking onto an exhaust.

Not sure about that, I was always told all fires need three things: fuel, ignition and oxygen. 
The latest hi-tech equipment that’s being deployed to fight the anti-christ that is the EV fire… the good old fashioned fire blanket! Great big car sized ones. Cuts off the oxygen.

Chemical fires that have their own oxidizers or release their own oxygen  will burn under water no problem. 

Have you never chucked a block of sodium down the school toilet ? 

[E30 325i Rag-Top 2963]

As I understand it, the lithium ion reaction creates a runaway heat situation, even without the oxygen to burn. As soon as any oxygen gets in it flares up into a fire again, and takes ages to cool down.

Whereas old fashioned petrol engined cars go whoomph, burn out quickly and then go to the scrappy.

I’d be pretty sure there’s more emissions from ICE fires than EVs, mainly because there’s more of them. Yes, an EV probably chucks out a few more nasties, but less of them.

[Breaker 980]

Truck fires are way cooler then EV ones, take way more resource to put out and tidy up and happen in NZ quite a lot, nothing to do with V12s …. However

[polley 916]

See a few excavators / trucks burnt out. Battery cables rub through on the chassis. 

Edited January 24, 2022 by polley

[Breaker 980]

Locked brake on the one above, same results 

[KwS 2429]

What sort of backwards hillbilly logic is that? "A burning EV makes more emissions than an ICE car, thus it is bad".

Cmon now.

[Michael. 2313]

Proud hillbilly here, whats the problem? 

I enjoy being backwards. 

I'm just poking fun anyway duh 

[dirtydoogle 383]

On 1/23/2022 at 11:20 PM, Michael. said:

 

I wonder if any studies have been done to examine the co2 output of a singular fire from the specifications this runaway fire would produce. 

Funny you mention it,

[Michael. 2313]

How fascinating, some interesting data there. 

[dirtydoogle 383]

Not going to lie, no way would I read 240 pages on why we shouldn't burn our toys