DD suggestions for 5-600kms a week

[martyyyn 102]

Im about to start doing a considerable amount of kms a week and need a new daily for the job. We also need to upgrade the family wagon so Im wondering if I can kill two birds with one stone, or whether it would be wiser to get two cars.

My initial thoughts were an e39 touring. The 528 we had was 'reasonable' around town but I didnt have it long enough to know what it would be like doing 2000+km a month on the open road. Ive considered both a 407 and Mondeo diesel with a chip, but for the newer ones youre looking at up to 20k for the car in the first place and Im not sure how long it will be before the initial outlay repays itself.

Ive had 8l/100km from a 540 and wasnt that far off in my 740, and although I know the big engine is barely ticking over they still seem excessive. There is a 2003 525 touring down here at the moment which looks promising but I have no idea what that might do and to be driving a wagon with only me in it doesnt really make sense when its my wife who will need a wagon more.

My wife's mileage will be minimal but also be open road and with the kids in it in needs to be as safe as possible. There have been a few crashes recently where little wagons have folded like cardboard so no lightweight Jap boxes.

I know nothing about diesel charges in NZ (other than diesel itself if 3/4's petrol a litre) and have had conflicting advice on whether it would be worth it or not. I think its a no brainer to go diesel myeslf, but a friend who does similiar mileage says otherwise based on the additional costs over the year and has just bought a 1.6 Corolla.

I really dont want to spend any more than 15k but if something exceptional came up I might pay more. If I go for one car, it needs to comfortably fit two tall adults and three tall kids with all the kit when we go away. If I buy two then the wagon needs to fit those criteria but doesnt need to be super fuel efficient, whereas the one for me would and it cant be a little hatchback. An e39 sedan with a roofbox might replace a touring as they are considerably cheaper and more abundant.

I know the new Peugeots can get phenominal kms from a tank, but how efficient are the older ones, say a 406 from 2001-ish ? Would an e46 318 do the job for me or would a 328 still give me similar kms over long distance ? Ill be driving outside of peak hours so being able to drive to the limits shouldnt be a problem and there will pretty much no town driving at all.

Audi's and VW's (in my price range) often dont have three headrests in the rear too, but I might be able to handle a Golf for myself if they are good enough on fuel.

So, any sensible thoughts on my options ?

[deeveus 81]

Buy my 320d, she's done 214kms but is super reliable and gets below 5liters per 100km on the open road.

[_ethrty-Andy_ 2122]

our mk3 mondo wagon is good, should have got a falcon wagon tho, despite it's looks you can probably fit less than a corolla wagon inside. Have you thought about a Volvo wagon? A lot of car for the dollar and thy aren't slouches like they uses to be though just as safe etc

[Allanw 1051]

There is the possibility of more to go wrong with a diesel. Turbos and all that jazz. Not so bad on a newer car that's been looked after, but older ones can give some big bills, and may be uneconomic to repair.

Remember that a diesel car costs 4.5c a km on top of the fuel. 2000kms a month is another $90.

Also, a E39 is never going to be really cheap to run, as they are heavy.

Personally, I'd go petrol, especially if you were getting a cheaper car.

[deeveus 81]

Also, considered one of these http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/...n-478816025.htm

[hybrid 1039]

Open road a v8 e39 is fine and pretty much on par with other vehicles. Around town is where it gets worse, But I will say not lots and lots worse. It really is about how and where you drive.

TBH, I would go something 2ltr for the open road stuff with cruse control. What will matter is the interior and how comfortible it is. However a well serviced 530 might be the go.

[martyyyn 102]

Clinton, your 320d wont be in my price range as a car for me alone and its nowhere big enough for the five of us. Im a huge Focus fan, weve had one for five years and its been faultless. But as a family we are getting too big for it and Id rather have something a bigger on the open road which is why I thought of a Mondeo or 407.

Allan, older diesels are a concern certainly and Id only be buying something with a fully stamped maintenance record. There arent any other charges over and above RUC are there ?

Josh, there really will be very little town driving and having owned 750's, 740's and 540's I know just how good they can be on the open road. Finding a good, unmolested and well looked after 540 for under 15k is doable, but its all the budget on one car with the potential for some very big bills should something go wrong. Im not a fan of the steering in the v8's so the 530 is a good shout.

Given M62's start to require some decent money to be spent on them at around 140-180kms whats the story with older diesels, or just diesels in general ? Does anyone know real-world cases rather than the 'do the cambelt at 100k kms or it will go pop' comments.

Ive done some quick sums with the worst case scenario of having to do 700kms a week.

In the 535is I can get 11 l/100km, at $2.20 a litre with a 70l tank, thats $8000 a year.

My wife's 1.6 Focus wagon is only fractionally better so the saving is simply using 91 instead of 95 and is only a couple of hundred a year.

An M62 returning 8 l/100km is $6400 a year (saving $1600)

A 407 returning 7 l/100km is $5435 a year (saving $2573)

Clintons 320d returning 5 l/100km is $4350 a year (saving $3658)

So unless Ive missed something by the time youve factored in the cost of the car in the first place its going to take a good four or five years to come out even. Seeing as I dont intend to be doing this for more than a couple of years at the most it hardly seems worth looking into it.

So maybe I just spend the money keeping the 535is in tip-top condition and spend 10k on upgrading the Focus to something bigger.

I have to say Im surprised. I was really expecting diesel to be an option but it comes down to the cost of buying the car in the first place when the e34 can give a reasonable 11l/100kms in the first place.

[deeveus 81]

We were only after 8500 for the car IF we were going to sell but the size thing just isn't favorable for you. From this perspective, if you did spend 20-25k the whole game would change and you'd recoup a lot of money from buying a more expensive cheaper to run car than a cheaper 15k petrol car, i.e E60 530d ? Just get a warranty, not for the engines as they are pretty reliable but the rest of the car lol. They are about for circa 20-25k and they travel brilliantly on the open road & the 500nm will put a big smile on your chops!

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Edited June 6, 2012 by The Diesel Guy

[nath 129]

Toyota Avensis. Safe, wont break down, and isn't an old euro trying to be 'flash'.

[huff3r 347]

Other costs to consider for diesels... Rego. It's pricy to say the least.

[allan 295]

This may be of some help a 2002 406HDi auto Peugeot getting 1100km to a tank of diesel about 72ltr tank this lasts my wife a fortnight it is not bad to ride in either. RUC is 4.5cts a k and rego is $480 odd may need to check on service periods compared to petrol. Have heard that the 407 is hungry on fuel compared to the 406 due to the increase of HP. Getting on chipped is not cheep around a grand but might be worth checking it out if your that way inclined

The 2002 e39 530i I had did 735 to 750k to a tank on 95 a little more on 98 tank held 70 odd ltrs. The ride was great this was about 90 percent open highway running for both vehicles.

Cheers allan

[martyyyn 102]

We were only after 8500 for the car IF we were going to sell but the size thing just isn't favorable for you.

Really ? I thought 320d's were going for much more than that ?

From this perspective, if you did spend 20-25k the whole game would change and you'd recoup a lot of money from buying a more expensive cheaper to run car than a cheaper 15k petrol car

Hmmm, spend more to save more, Im sure the wife will buy that I assume what you mean is....

Option 1: Drive the 535is. Buy the wife a 407/Mondeo for $15k. Five years = $55k spent.

Option 2: Buy a 530d for $25k. Spend $5.5k a year in fuel. Sell Focus for 5k. Wife drives 535is. Five years = $47k spent.

Of course this lends itself to....

Option 3: Buy a 407 diesel for $15k. $5.5k a year in fuel. Sell Focus for 5k. Wife drives 535is. Five years = $37k

This is assuming 7 l/100klm for both the 407 and 530d. I know the 407 will do it, the forums seem to be mixed on whether the 530d will do it consistently.

My wifes mileage will be minimal, school run, supermarket, the odd trip to Wellington so I havent bothered to factor anything in for it.

So for an extra $2k a year would you have the 530d ahead of a 407

[martyyyn 102]

This may be of some help a 2002 406HDi auto Peugeot getting 1100km to a tank of diesel about 72ltr tank this lasts my wife a fortnight it is not bad to ride in either. RUC is 4.5cts a k and rego is $480 odd may need to check on service periods compared to petrol. Have heard that the 407 is hungry on fuel compared to the 406 due to the increase of HP. Getting on chipped is not cheep around a grand but might be worth checking it out if your that way inclined

The 2002 e39 530i I had did 735 to 750k to a tank on 95 a little more on 98 tank held 70 odd ltrs. The ride was great this was about 90 percent open highway running for both vehicles.

Cheers allan

Thats perfect, thanks Allan.

We had a 406SRi turbo in the UK and loved it, so hearing the 2002 HDi's are good is great news. 1100klms from a tank is a rough 7l/100klm and its surprising to see the e39 530 isnt much better than my 535is.

[m325i 705]

The diesel stories are making me want to hypermile!

That's some crazy stats.

Is there a 'milage' thread? Some one start one. I was getting 450km per tank 7.5l/km, better with VANOS fix.

What about a Toyota Crown? You could get some diplomatic flags for it.

[euroriffic 601]

What about a low km e36 325/328 for yourself? As youl know from the 528 you had they have good power and torque for passing, hills etc and the motors just ticking along when at 100km. I was amazed at mine from town driving to open road. Towns about 400km a tank and managed about 700-800km on a trip from Hokitika to chch, bit of city driving then to Dunedin with 3 people and a boot of bags etc and there's some pretty big hills to climb and very twisty Speed up/slow down parts through arthers pass and I was having abit of fun so could of been abit better.

And they are usually well spec'd too so a nice place to be and pretty cheap to maintain.

[deeveus 81]

Do the numbers on the fuel economy vs RUC I did and I was staggered how much smaller diesels get caned. A 320i is MUCH cheaper to run than a 320D and thats ot taking nto acount the registration which is aslo disproportionately heavy. I have a spread sheet I could dig out and post

It makes even more sense in a larger car when talking about this subject over and over but when I work things out, a F30 320i is still slightly more expensive to run than a 320d and the 320d is a much nicer car to drive IMO.

Workings on topic as per the topic of this thread but with a brand new 320i/d

$44.31 x 30 @ 2 tonne (30,000kms) = $1329.30 for RUC

Petrol for the year @ quoted 6.0L / 100km would cost $3960 @ $2.20 per litre

Diesel for the year @ quoted 4.5 / 100km would cost $1984.50 @ $1.47 per litre

Registrations @ $560.92 for Diesel & $431.06 for petrol

- 30,000kms p/a - a 320d diesel will cost you $3874.72 (REG, Fuel)

- 30,000kms p/a - a 320i petrol will cost you $4391.06 (RUC, REG, Fuel)

Ok, so only 500 bucks a year cheaper @ 30,000kms, or if he intends to own for 5 years, $2500 saving. IMO the Diesel will fetch more when it comes time to sell. They 0-100 times are the same, same 135KW, but 380nm diesel vs 270nm petrol, diesel far superior on open road. Even though the fuel consumption figures are 4.5 for diesel vs 6.0 for petrol, on the open road the diesel will be even more economical than the petrol. The two cars also are the same RRP.

Don't go French IMO - You'd be a deaf man if you'd never heard stories of reliability.

Edited June 6, 2012 by The Diesel Guy

[Michael. 2312]

The diesel stories are making me want to hypermile!

That's some crazy stats.

Is there a 'milage' thread? Some one start one. I was getting 450km per tank 7.5l/km, better with VANOS fix.

What about a Toyota Crown? You could get some diplomatic flags for it.

I love the high end JDM Saloons that Toyota offer, they are very decent cars, a touch boring for most, but I can see past all that. These Crown & Majesta models are the best of the Toyota Branding before going to a Lexus. (Aside from the Toyota Century)

[kiwi535 538]

real world economy from my diesel is 6.5 litre 100 k,ruc is about 30 bucks per tank.I regularly get 700 odd ks from 45-48 litres.On the open road i easliy get in the 5s...up to 900 ks from the same 45 -50 litres.

The ruc is 230 odd bucks for 5000k,Registration is 400 odd cos there is less acc component on the diesel at the pump so you pay the extra ACC when you re license.The service intervals (by the service indicator last time was 17000 ks,and its a nice wee drive,nice steering and brakes.I would imagine a 320d would be very similar.

[deeveus 81]

real world economy from my diesel is 6.5 litre 100 k,ruc is about 30 bucks per tank.I regularly get 700 odd ks from 45-48 litres.On the open road i easliy get in the 5s...up to 900 ks from the same 45 -50 litres.

The ruc is 230 odd bucks for 5000k,Registration is 400 odd cos there is less acc component on the diesel at the pump so you pay the extra ACC when you re license.The service intervals (by the service indicator last time was 17000 ks,and its a nice wee drive,nice steering and brakes.I would imagine a 320d would be very similar.

Our little 320d manual is getting well below 5 on the open road, unless your open roading has some hills in it I guess. The RL figures and claimed figures are relevant as they both increase slightly for RL figures.

[kiwi535 538]

Our little 320d manual is getting well below 5 on the open road, unless your open roading has some hills in it I guess. The RL figures and claimed figures are relevant as they both increase slightly for RL figures.

you are right.even the slightest hill puts you off those 4 l numbers.When i am on the open road i often see flash readings in the 2 and 3 l rangeMy normal "round town running is fairly free but involves either hills or traffic lights.What year is your 320?

[deeveus 81]

you are right.even the slightest hill puts you off those 4 l numbers.When i am on the open road i often see flash readings in the 2 and 3 l rangeMy normal "round town running is fairly free but involves either hills or traffic lights.What year is your 320?

It's a E46 2000 model. It's averaging about 6.2

[westy 614]

Ive done some quick sums with the worst case scenario of having to do 700kms a week.

An M62 returning 8 l/100km is $6400 a year (saving $1600)

I cant see you getting 8l/100km from a M62.

[zenetti 0]

I cant see you getting 8l/100km from a M62.

Me either, the best I have ever had is 9.8 travelling to Gisborne and back and no "spirited driving"

[skidz 196]

Im about to start doing a considerable amount of kms a week and need a new daily for the job. We also need to upgrade the family wagon so Im wondering if I can kill two birds with one stone, or whether it would be wiser to get two cars.

My initial thoughts were an e39 touring. The 528 we had was 'reasonable' around town but I didnt have it long enough to know what it would be like doing 2000+km a month on the open road. Ive considered both a 407 and Mondeo diesel with a chip, but for the newer ones youre looking at up to 20k for the car in the first place and Im not sure how long it will be before the initial outlay repays itself.

Ive had 8l/100km from a 540 and wasnt that far off in my 740, and although I know the big engine is barely ticking over they still seem excessive. There is a 2003 525 touring down here at the moment which looks promising but I have no idea what that might do and to be driving a wagon with only me in it doesnt really make sense when its my wife who will need a wagon more.

My wife's mileage will be minimal but also be open road and with the kids in it in needs to be as safe as possible. There have been a few crashes recently where little wagons have folded like cardboard so no lightweight Jap boxes.

I know nothing about diesel charges in NZ (other than diesel itself if 3/4's petrol a litre) and have had conflicting advice on whether it would be worth it or not. I think its a no brainer to go diesel myeslf, but a friend who does similiar mileage says otherwise based on the additional costs over the year and has just bought a 1.6 Corolla.

I really dont want to spend any more than 15k but if something exceptional came up I might pay more. If I go for one car, it needs to comfortably fit two tall adults and three tall kids with all the kit when we go away. If I buy two then the wagon needs to fit those criteria but doesnt need to be super fuel efficient, whereas the one for me would and it cant be a little hatchback. An e39 sedan with a roofbox might replace a touring as they are considerably cheaper and more abundant.

I know the new Peugeots can get phenominal kms from a tank, but how efficient are the older ones, say a 406 from 2001-ish ? Would an e46 318 do the job for me or would a 328 still give me similar kms over long distance ? Ill be driving outside of peak hours so being able to drive to the limits shouldnt be a problem and there will pretty much no town driving at all.

Audi's and VW's (in my price range) often dont have three headrests in the rear too, but I might be able to handle a Golf for myself if they are good enough on fuel.

So, any sensible thoughts on my options ?

What you need is an E30 318is as your daily.

[westy 614]

Me either, the best I have ever had is 9.8 travelling to Gisborne and back and no "spirited driving"

I'm averaging 11.9 according to comp thingy, mostly open road.

Best I've seen is 8.9 straight Auck motorway from Hampton to Silverdale.